So I posted this at the end of another thread (Pain in our Past...), but I thought maybe it deserved to be its own topic. I dunno.
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I might get a lot of flack for this posting, but we'll see.
Reading all of your posts, and knowing my story, and knowing the stories of so many other addicts or people with severe anxiety/depression, makes me wonder if it was inevitable... the addiction thing.
Now, I know we are all responsible for our own actions, and we have the power to make choices, but if we are making choices in the context of never having learned real coping skills, of reliving past trauma, of being in current trauma, then are the choices really ours or are they beyond our control? Is it really so abnormal to be looking for something that will fill up the pain and need tht stems from a life time of f***ed up s***? Sometimes I don't think so. I think personal accountability and responsibility is all well and good, but we can't deny that bad choices come from bad coping skills and bad coping skills come from a million different sources, starting from when we were little.
I just don't know how we can blame ourselves all the time or take complete responsibility for our actions when there is no doubt in my mind that my family history, my genetic make up, my lack of defense mechanisms (or ones that worked that became dysfunctional or obsolete over time) pushed me in the direction of looking for something that would just make s*** go away....
Does this make sense/ Am I totally wrong here?
Hi Soul!!
Well that is the delimma of addiction, isn't it. What came first the disease or the bottle, and what about personal responsibility? Just say no!!! ( what a joke)
I'm an addict, plain and simple. Looking at my patterns, I can see that clearly now. Are we set up to be so?? That's the great question. My sponsor would say " It is what it is"
That is whereI fully admit, I am powerless over drugs and alcohol, and my life became unmanageable. We could have all the amazing will power, but it's not enough, or there would be no addicts, we would just simply stop. I know it wasn't enough for me. Each time I would swallow another pill, it was the last time, until the next. So on and so on, until I just didn't care and wanted to just end it all.
What will save us then. You have to surrender( sounds ironic) and realize there is a power( or force) outside of yourself that will restore yourself to sanity. This was tough for me. I have always thought surrender was a sign of weakness, and being a nurse, I thought I could heal myself and not have to reveal my abuse to anyone. After all I thought I'd loose my ability to ever work again. That delusion kept me using longer.
This the cornerstone to the first 2 steps othe 12 steps. I found the info in the Big Book to speak more to the male, instead, my sponsor gave me " A Woman's Way through the Twelve Steps". This book also has a workbook along with it. It comes from a more female perspective and will address our issues, esp. the guilt we tend to focus on. Look it up. I found it at a local Barnes and Noble, but Amazon has it also.
The way I have come to grips with this all, is to be grateful that I have finally found a way to live that forces me too look hard at myself and to live "clean"
I heard that in a meeting and really thought that thru when I got home. Clean in every respect, clearing the slate at nite and giving thanks for what I already have. Works for me.
I had just the same feelings you have now. I'm glad you are asking these questions. It's all journey, and such an amazing opportunity for us to really change everything about ourselves. Each day is a do over!!
Well that is the delimma of addiction, isn't it. What came first the disease or the bottle, and what about personal responsibility? Just say no!!! ( what a joke)
I'm an addict, plain and simple. Looking at my patterns, I can see that clearly now. Are we set up to be so?? That's the great question. My sponsor would say " It is what it is"
That is whereI fully admit, I am powerless over drugs and alcohol, and my life became unmanageable. We could have all the amazing will power, but it's not enough, or there would be no addicts, we would just simply stop. I know it wasn't enough for me. Each time I would swallow another pill, it was the last time, until the next. So on and so on, until I just didn't care and wanted to just end it all.
What will save us then. You have to surrender( sounds ironic) and realize there is a power( or force) outside of yourself that will restore yourself to sanity. This was tough for me. I have always thought surrender was a sign of weakness, and being a nurse, I thought I could heal myself and not have to reveal my abuse to anyone. After all I thought I'd loose my ability to ever work again. That delusion kept me using longer.
This the cornerstone to the first 2 steps othe 12 steps. I found the info in the Big Book to speak more to the male, instead, my sponsor gave me " A Woman's Way through the Twelve Steps". This book also has a workbook along with it. It comes from a more female perspective and will address our issues, esp. the guilt we tend to focus on. Look it up. I found it at a local Barnes and Noble, but Amazon has it also.
The way I have come to grips with this all, is to be grateful that I have finally found a way to live that forces me too look hard at myself and to live "clean"
I heard that in a meeting and really thought that thru when I got home. Clean in every respect, clearing the slate at nite and giving thanks for what I already have. Works for me.
I had just the same feelings you have now. I'm glad you are asking these questions. It's all journey, and such an amazing opportunity for us to really change everything about ourselves. Each day is a do over!!
I used to blame everyone/thing else. My Doctor, my screwed up childhood, stress from the job, a bad marriage, my car wouldnt start, I have pain, the Cubs lost, my daughter is dating a guy named "Snake", I stubbed my toe, I can't sleep..1000 excuses, none valid enough to me to contiue as an addict. So we can blame all we want but in the end, it comes down to you and you alone.
And yes, I just said "No" and stuck to it..
And yes, I just said "No" and stuck to it..
posted by kafo
Thank you for this. "Responsible" or "not responsible", irrelevant. The only responsibility is to: 1) Stop taking drugs. 2) Don't have those coping skills/social skills, etc? Learn them, start learning them. 3) Have depression/anxiety? Get therapy, medical help. Yup, that is the addict's responsibility. In fact, they are the only ones who can do it. I don't know about the "responsibility" about becoming an addict, but I do know that one is responsible for starting and working recovery. Not one's family, or work, or doctor or whoever/whatever.
As for 3), I know about that one from personal experience. Yup, I suffer from chronic, occasionally acute depression. Did it contribute to me becoming an addict? Maybe, but not relevant in recovery other than working on my depression makes my life better and lessens chances of relapse. Makes me more functional period. Just quitting drugs may not make one more functional.
As for family histories/genetics "making" one an addict? Meah. I came from a good family, no addict histories, and pretty darn functional too. Yet here I am, a recovering addict. Guess there is no excuse for me, and you know what? I am glad. This ain't set in stone, change is possible.
Bullwinkle1011, that was a hilarious post, my reasons could just not compare.....
| QUOTE |
I'm an addict, plain and simple. Looking at my patterns, I can see that clearly now. Are we set up to be so?? That's the great question. My sponsor would say " It is what it is" |
Thank you for this. "Responsible" or "not responsible", irrelevant. The only responsibility is to: 1) Stop taking drugs. 2) Don't have those coping skills/social skills, etc? Learn them, start learning them. 3) Have depression/anxiety? Get therapy, medical help. Yup, that is the addict's responsibility. In fact, they are the only ones who can do it. I don't know about the "responsibility" about becoming an addict, but I do know that one is responsible for starting and working recovery. Not one's family, or work, or doctor or whoever/whatever.
As for 3), I know about that one from personal experience. Yup, I suffer from chronic, occasionally acute depression. Did it contribute to me becoming an addict? Maybe, but not relevant in recovery other than working on my depression makes my life better and lessens chances of relapse. Makes me more functional period. Just quitting drugs may not make one more functional.
As for family histories/genetics "making" one an addict? Meah. I came from a good family, no addict histories, and pretty darn functional too. Yet here I am, a recovering addict. Guess there is no excuse for me, and you know what? I am glad. This ain't set in stone, change is possible.
Bullwinkle1011, that was a hilarious post, my reasons could just not compare.....
I just think it's relevant - not in the "ok, i jsut stop have to using now no matter what happened," but to acknowledge history and context that may have led us to poor choices. I don't think we can deny that it exists, nor do I think that by acknowledging it, we aren't taking responsibility for "just saying no" (now) and moving forward. But I think it's important because it exists. Because addiction isn't as simple as "I made my bed, now I have to go sleep in the piss covered sheets because I pissed in it too..." And that's not denial talking, it's just reality.
Yes, history can play a part, but in the end, it is only helpful in determining where work needs to be done to aid in recovery. Yup bad history can be there. But the way I look at that is...."Bad, horrible childhood, no social skills, became addict. More news at ten." No particularly revelatory at all. Using it to point where one should go to heal from the past, ah, now that is worth something. I really don't care how if one thinks becoming an addict is inevitable, much more helpful to look on the path forward, not backward. Especially in early recovery.
Not all people from bad families or addict families become addicts. I know, as I have said, I came from neither yet here I am and I am not unique in this.....
Not all people from bad families or addict families become addicts. I know, as I have said, I came from neither yet here I am and I am not unique in this.....
I remember when I was a teenager and my Mom went into treatment for alcoholism and I was so disgusted with her. There were alot of other issues besides the alcoholism but there usually is. Then when I was in my late teens, I found out my oldest sister was an addict. And I remember thinking to myself I would never be that stupid and why doesn't she just quit taking drugs. I had all the bad examples of addiction right in front of me yet in my mid twenties I became addicted to pain pills. I don't really understand how this happened but I understand that it did happen. And I think what someone else posted is right on the money. Whether or not it's all our fault why it happened is irrelavent. It is our fault if we don't stop it by getting into recovery.
quote by Kafo
And for me, by surrendering I learned acceptance and with acceptance came the fact it didn't matter what got me to where I am, it's what I do today and continue to do that is important.
It was a process to get to where I am in recovery...be gentle with yourself, Soul and baby steps....and as far as the pissed covered sheets, for me, when I quit using/abusing and started doing the next right thing, I didn't have to worry about sleeping in piss anymore.
Elim-Good to see you around and you are dead on about not being unique...LOL..When I look in the mirror, you could be looking back...and today, it is a blessing to know that I'm no longer alone or unique in this....
Bull~OMG, if I was still drinking, I'd been drunk yesterday by the 3rd quarter...I so get where you're coming from as I could rationalize a drink/drug with the best of them.....
Take care,
Stacey
| QUOTE |
| You have to surrender( sounds ironic) and realize there is a power( or force) outside of yourself that will restore yourself to sanity. |
And for me, by surrendering I learned acceptance and with acceptance came the fact it didn't matter what got me to where I am, it's what I do today and continue to do that is important.
It was a process to get to where I am in recovery...be gentle with yourself, Soul and baby steps....and as far as the pissed covered sheets, for me, when I quit using/abusing and started doing the next right thing, I didn't have to worry about sleeping in piss anymore.
Elim-Good to see you around and you are dead on about not being unique...LOL..When I look in the mirror, you could be looking back...and today, it is a blessing to know that I'm no longer alone or unique in this....
Bull~OMG, if I was still drinking, I'd been drunk yesterday by the 3rd quarter...I so get where you're coming from as I could rationalize a drink/drug with the best of them.....
Take care,
Stacey
I tripped over the same stumblings blocks at first also. Luckily my first day of treatment my wise counselor ask me what made me so special. I looked at him, like he was cracked. Of course I was special, didn't he see that. Well I looked around the room. There were old and young alchololics, a chick with pink hair that sold herself so she could stick a needle in her arm, and me a nice middle aged pill abuser. There had to be special class for me, since I clearly had nothing in common with these addicts.
Well I had a divine intervention that night, since the next morning I had to admit in class that I was NO diferent than anyone there and that began my journey to acceptance.
It's not until we realize that it's no different as far as the kind of bottle, the type of drug, how extensive the menu we took from, we are addicts!!! But there is a way for us to recover, and that is by having a program of recovery.
I used to beat myself up. I came from a nice family. My mother was June Cleaver. She wore dresses at home, kept a clean house, an active member of PTA and so on. I went to church each Sunday in my best clothing and was acive in youth groups, had great grades in school. Yada--yada. So what happened?? Well sh-- does happen, but we move on and do what we have to. Does God give us addiction. No my God doesn't inflict harm, he loves and supports me thru everyday.
So, Soul. You have very valid questions. These are all the questions we have to go thru. By working thru the steps (in order at first) you will gain strength to really examine your patterns, take a fearless inventory and turn it over to God and another human being( best a sponsor) Then move on.
I love being in recovery. My life is grand!! But it is a daily journey. I can look back at those days without pain and guily now. I take care of business in an adult responsible way now, not putting my selfish needs before others and I can laugh at myself and with others about the past. All takes time and healing.
Hang in there. Oh and good luck returning to work!! E-mail me any time you want.
Well I had a divine intervention that night, since the next morning I had to admit in class that I was NO diferent than anyone there and that began my journey to acceptance.
It's not until we realize that it's no different as far as the kind of bottle, the type of drug, how extensive the menu we took from, we are addicts!!! But there is a way for us to recover, and that is by having a program of recovery.
I used to beat myself up. I came from a nice family. My mother was June Cleaver. She wore dresses at home, kept a clean house, an active member of PTA and so on. I went to church each Sunday in my best clothing and was acive in youth groups, had great grades in school. Yada--yada. So what happened?? Well sh-- does happen, but we move on and do what we have to. Does God give us addiction. No my God doesn't inflict harm, he loves and supports me thru everyday.
So, Soul. You have very valid questions. These are all the questions we have to go thru. By working thru the steps (in order at first) you will gain strength to really examine your patterns, take a fearless inventory and turn it over to God and another human being( best a sponsor) Then move on.
I love being in recovery. My life is grand!! But it is a daily journey. I can look back at those days without pain and guily now. I take care of business in an adult responsible way now, not putting my selfish needs before others and I can laugh at myself and with others about the past. All takes time and healing.
Hang in there. Oh and good luck returning to work!! E-mail me any time you want.
Stace- Yesterday was a prime example. I picked up and friend and went to a party where there were about 20 people/ All friends and stuff. But by the 3rd quarter, people were pretty disgusted and were drinking pretty heavily and smoking dope or whatever. The person I was with was drinking, all my friends were and smoking dope and who knows what else and I certainly wasnt happy with the game and 3 or 4 years ago, it would of been an exuse to have an extra beer or two, smoke some dope, whatever..I ate gaucamole and drank a Coke. I had just as good of time as if I was popping a Budwiser. Probably better.
I still think the pain you feel from addiction is worse than any pain you are going to feel in a drug/alcohol free life. Way worse.
I still think the pain you feel from addiction is worse than any pain you are going to feel in a drug/alcohol free life. Way worse.
On Saturday night my daughter was at a church conference. I was at home cooking barbeque, sipping on an alcoholic drink, knowing full well I had to pick her up in a few hours. What did I do? I had another, thinking, well it's my Saturday night too and [poor me] just wants to relax and have fun.
Needless to say, I called a cab for my daughter and she was mortified that I wasn't able to pick her up.
I was so ashamed of myself and realised the pull that booze has over me.
I havn't had a drink for two days. One day at a time
I just needed to put this out there. I have known for a long time that I have a problem, but now I know I'm powerless
Wendy
Needless to say, I called a cab for my daughter and she was mortified that I wasn't able to pick her up.
I was so ashamed of myself and realised the pull that booze has over me.
I havn't had a drink for two days. One day at a time
I just needed to put this out there. I have known for a long time that I have a problem, but now I know I'm powerless
Wendy
soul,
I think it (history) can be very relevent but usually not early on. Most people use the bad childhood as a crutch or a way to ease there minds around their addiction and powerlessness, guilt, and shame.... so honestly do it subconsciously and for protective reasons not to play the poor me card or the blame game really.. it is a defense mechanism in a way but a dysfunctional one that can cause trouble.... it can cause us early in recovery when learning new ways, not using, and going forward clean to lose focus on the here and now and start work on our inner child thing... If you had a bad childhood and addiction as I did, then in good time those issues need addressed... but for now.. forward.... it really isnt relevent at this stage....in my opionion....
The biggest reason that it is still relevent even after all my therapy and on going codependency work is that if there is a nature/nurture component to this disease which I am convinced there is, then I want to help prevent my daughter from suffering into the same hole as I did. This starts with me and how I parent... and how/when I give her all the info she needs.... As a nurse also I knew in the back of my mind that as an only child of an alcoholic father, I not only had a higher than normal chance of developing my own disease or marrying someone with one but I had a 75% greater chance and yet.... as someone said here I sit.... a recovering addict.... not special... just me....I have to give my kid the best chance but ultimately if I stay clean, work the steps and do the next right thing daily then maybe with the grace of God I can stop the cycle......
God Bless and good luck...
teresa
btw, the stats are stagering on the number of nurses that are codependent and/or come from some sort of abusive, addictive childhood trauma.... something in the high 70 percentile.... we are usually by nature caregivers......
I think it (history) can be very relevent but usually not early on. Most people use the bad childhood as a crutch or a way to ease there minds around their addiction and powerlessness, guilt, and shame.... so honestly do it subconsciously and for protective reasons not to play the poor me card or the blame game really.. it is a defense mechanism in a way but a dysfunctional one that can cause trouble.... it can cause us early in recovery when learning new ways, not using, and going forward clean to lose focus on the here and now and start work on our inner child thing... If you had a bad childhood and addiction as I did, then in good time those issues need addressed... but for now.. forward.... it really isnt relevent at this stage....in my opionion....
The biggest reason that it is still relevent even after all my therapy and on going codependency work is that if there is a nature/nurture component to this disease which I am convinced there is, then I want to help prevent my daughter from suffering into the same hole as I did. This starts with me and how I parent... and how/when I give her all the info she needs.... As a nurse also I knew in the back of my mind that as an only child of an alcoholic father, I not only had a higher than normal chance of developing my own disease or marrying someone with one but I had a 75% greater chance and yet.... as someone said here I sit.... a recovering addict.... not special... just me....I have to give my kid the best chance but ultimately if I stay clean, work the steps and do the next right thing daily then maybe with the grace of God I can stop the cycle......
God Bless and good luck...
teresa
btw, the stats are stagering on the number of nurses that are codependent and/or come from some sort of abusive, addictive childhood trauma.... something in the high 70 percentile.... we are usually by nature caregivers......
