Hi ctink and everyone else, God bless you, hope you're having a great day, I miss you all! I'm so glad Julie has befriended all of you, please keep writing her! I will get her an email address soon so you can write her directly.
Julie is still sleeping & I told her I wanted to get on the board and ask these questions. She was ok with that.
Ok, so here goes.
Julie is doing "ok" on the suboxone but is very nauseated frequently and actually vomited last nite after taking an entire pill (8 mg). She let it melt under her tongue in quarters. We're not really sure how she should be taking this medication. The doc said "up to" 16 mg a day. What she WAS doing is taking 1 quarter every few hours to where she took about 1 and 1/4 pills a day throughout the day. She was feeling nauseated and not much appetite.
So our questions are:
1) If she vomits right after taking it, does that mean it's not in her system anymore? I would think it would still be there because it wasn't totally "in her stomach" like when you swallow a pill.
2) Should she be taking it with food each time?
3) I am assuming 8 mg at one time is way too much for her, after having read that most people start off at way lower than that .... how did you guys take it? Did you break it up an take 1 quarter every few hours like she was doing? Or did you take the whole pill at once or twice a day or what?
4) She is seeming to want to swallow it, I keep telling YOU CAN'T DO THAT!!! She's like "why not?" Please explain this to her!!!!
5) She seems to not be taking it "regularly". Like if she feels ok then she just doesn't take it, she waits until she starts feeling bad, is this the way you're supposed to do it or should she be taking it like clockwork, for example, 1/4 at 9 am, 1/4 at noon, 1/4 at 3pm, 1/4 at 6 pm, etc. I would think taking it regularly like we do other meds would be best!!
HELP.
Thanks, love you all.
The directions say 1 pill twice a day. So we said ok, let's do it how it says to do it, maybe she's not taking enough
Good morning I had a feeling this was going to happen because she keeps asking every time she post.
1) As for the nausea I know you do not want to spend any more $$ but if you will go to the drug store and find Emetrol and then buy the generic that will work great and this problem can be taken care of as we do not want her to not take the meds as a result of not liking the nauseaso please go get this stuff.
2) I take 16 mg a day but I only took 12 mg for the first 6 weeks since the dr said to take up to 16 mg I would suggest this when she gets up to take one whole pill and it does not matter if she breaks it up or not I take mine whole first thing when I get up I know that they taste bad and it takes a few minutes but that is a small sacrifice.
3) You do have to let it dissolve under your tongue that is what it is a sublingual tablet it absorbs thru the 2 large veins under your tongue so if the pill has dissolved throwing up is not really going to affect her as the medicine is still in her sytem.Waiting until she feels sick is not good the whole point of the sub is to not feel like crap so you can develop a plan to stay sober .
4) Then at night before she goes to bed she can take another 4-8 mg I usually take mine at like 8-9:00 and then watching tv or something when I feel like I am getting tired I usually cut the tv off and do some relaxing activity as I have trouble going to sleep too.
I think this covers all of your questions got to make Arielley girl some breakfast today it is egg in the hole!!!
1) As for the nausea I know you do not want to spend any more $$ but if you will go to the drug store and find Emetrol and then buy the generic that will work great and this problem can be taken care of as we do not want her to not take the meds as a result of not liking the nauseaso please go get this stuff.
2) I take 16 mg a day but I only took 12 mg for the first 6 weeks since the dr said to take up to 16 mg I would suggest this when she gets up to take one whole pill and it does not matter if she breaks it up or not I take mine whole first thing when I get up I know that they taste bad and it takes a few minutes but that is a small sacrifice.
3) You do have to let it dissolve under your tongue that is what it is a sublingual tablet it absorbs thru the 2 large veins under your tongue so if the pill has dissolved throwing up is not really going to affect her as the medicine is still in her sytem.Waiting until she feels sick is not good the whole point of the sub is to not feel like crap so you can develop a plan to stay sober .
4) Then at night before she goes to bed she can take another 4-8 mg I usually take mine at like 8-9:00 and then watching tv or something when I feel like I am getting tired I usually cut the tv off and do some relaxing activity as I have trouble going to sleep too.
I think this covers all of your questions got to make Arielley girl some breakfast today it is egg in the hole!!!
The nausea could be to much, or to little she needs to talk to the doctor......
Lets make sure she is taking it right first. She shouldn't smoke a cigarette, if she smokes, before she doses it constricts the blood vessels.......She needs to put it under her tounge and keep it there even if it is desolved for 5-15 minutes. Then after she can spit what's in her mouth out or swallow it doesn't matter. The longer she can keep it in her mouth desolved the more med she is absorbing......
I would make sure she is taking it right first, and then move forward and see how she feels. If she throws up the medicine is still in her......If she just swallows the pill she will get nothing from it, nothing at all.....
I hope that some of this helped....
Take care
Love,
Tina
Lets make sure she is taking it right first. She shouldn't smoke a cigarette, if she smokes, before she doses it constricts the blood vessels.......She needs to put it under her tounge and keep it there even if it is desolved for 5-15 minutes. Then after she can spit what's in her mouth out or swallow it doesn't matter. The longer she can keep it in her mouth desolved the more med she is absorbing......
I would make sure she is taking it right first, and then move forward and see how she feels. If she throws up the medicine is still in her......If she just swallows the pill she will get nothing from it, nothing at all.....
I hope that some of this helped....
Take care
Love,
Tina
First of all, call the doctor and let him/ or her know what's going on.
He may even want to switch her to subutex, which is the same thing without the naloxone in it.
Nausea could be a withdrawl symptom, or a side effect from the medicine.
Swallowing it won't work. If you go to the suboxone website, and download the brochure, there is a photo of exactly where to put the pill under the tounge, and it explains how to break-up a dose.
She should not be chipping away at it. She should be taking more regular doses.
Any side effects will be worse the way she is taking it because the side effects (except sweating which could happen at any time)--the side effects usually peak the first few hours after you take it (if her symptoms are side effects from the meds).---so by continuing to take small doses instead of doseing less often, she is really getting more time to allow for side effects that occur shortly after taking it.
I did my program with a friend who thought that dissolving it under the tounge was nonsense--she swallowed it. It did not work at all for her.
Tell her to have a drink of water before she puts the pill under her tounge so that her mouth is wetter and it will disolve faster.
In the first few days it is a good idea to get on a regular schedule.
Twice a day is usually the most recomended by most doctors.
More than that re-inforces drug-taking behavior, may bring on more side effects, and, when you are taking the correct dose, you don't need to take it more than one or two times a day.
He may even want to switch her to subutex, which is the same thing without the naloxone in it.
Nausea could be a withdrawl symptom, or a side effect from the medicine.
Swallowing it won't work. If you go to the suboxone website, and download the brochure, there is a photo of exactly where to put the pill under the tounge, and it explains how to break-up a dose.
She should not be chipping away at it. She should be taking more regular doses.
Any side effects will be worse the way she is taking it because the side effects (except sweating which could happen at any time)--the side effects usually peak the first few hours after you take it (if her symptoms are side effects from the meds).---so by continuing to take small doses instead of doseing less often, she is really getting more time to allow for side effects that occur shortly after taking it.
I did my program with a friend who thought that dissolving it under the tounge was nonsense--she swallowed it. It did not work at all for her.
Tell her to have a drink of water before she puts the pill under her tounge so that her mouth is wetter and it will disolve faster.
In the first few days it is a good idea to get on a regular schedule.
Twice a day is usually the most recomended by most doctors.
More than that re-inforces drug-taking behavior, may bring on more side effects, and, when you are taking the correct dose, you don't need to take it more than one or two times a day.
Im on it too,Subutex is not an option for Julie . Thanks Cristina
I'm wondering why subutex would not be an option?
I'm in the US, and even though most doctors will not perscribe subutex, it is legal to do so.
I know this because my doctor prefers that his patients use subutex for the first week, and he writes a 'script for 1 week's worth of subutex, then switches them to suboxone.
Most pharmacies have to order it--but the doctor usually knows of one that has it in stock.
Also, for induction, or the first dose that is usually given in the doctor's office, that is usually the subutex.
One of the reasons that doctors prefer that the first dose is without the naloxone, is that they think that there is less of a risk of bringing on the precipitated withdrawl symptom. Since that dose is the first after using opiates.
Also, in methadone patients who are switching to suboxone, I think that subutex would be the med. of choice for the beginning stages of the treatment.
All of the info. that I have seen from reliable sources, says that swallowing the suboxone will not make the naloxone active. That the only way to activate the naloxone is by injecting it, but there are some people who claim that they are sensitive to the added ingreidient, and that they don't shoot it.
There are even people who insisit that it is easier to ween/taper-off, at the end of treatment, that it is somehow eaiser if you switch to subutex at the end.
If Julie was using street drugs, who knows if someone mixed-in some methadone? Maybe she even took some meth knowingly, and if she used methadone at any time in the past couple of weeks, that could still be in her system, and using suboxone with the added naloxone would be more likely to produce unpleasent side-effects.
I'm in the US, and even though most doctors will not perscribe subutex, it is legal to do so.
I know this because my doctor prefers that his patients use subutex for the first week, and he writes a 'script for 1 week's worth of subutex, then switches them to suboxone.
Most pharmacies have to order it--but the doctor usually knows of one that has it in stock.
Also, for induction, or the first dose that is usually given in the doctor's office, that is usually the subutex.
One of the reasons that doctors prefer that the first dose is without the naloxone, is that they think that there is less of a risk of bringing on the precipitated withdrawl symptom. Since that dose is the first after using opiates.
Also, in methadone patients who are switching to suboxone, I think that subutex would be the med. of choice for the beginning stages of the treatment.
All of the info. that I have seen from reliable sources, says that swallowing the suboxone will not make the naloxone active. That the only way to activate the naloxone is by injecting it, but there are some people who claim that they are sensitive to the added ingreidient, and that they don't shoot it.
There are even people who insisit that it is easier to ween/taper-off, at the end of treatment, that it is somehow eaiser if you switch to subutex at the end.
If Julie was using street drugs, who knows if someone mixed-in some methadone? Maybe she even took some meth knowingly, and if she used methadone at any time in the past couple of weeks, that could still be in her system, and using suboxone with the added naloxone would be more likely to produce unpleasent side-effects.
Thanks everyone. Julie took an entire pill (8mg) this a.m. under her tongue after eating and she has not been nauseated. We'll see how she is later in the day.
Im on it too
The whole point here is that Julie method of choice is iv get it now?
The whole point here is that Julie method of choice is iv get it now?
Cpvon,
Good deal I am glad that she is doing good this morning maybe you guys can rest around the house one day this week.I would suggest maybe you ladies go to the matinee or something mom and I really enjoy going to movies together when Arielle is not home it is really nice for us to have that time to be together without really feeling like we have to talk you know anyway it is just a suggestion to get Julies mind off of everything else for a little while when I was using I never went to the movies that is something you just do not do when you are getting high and I had to do things to learn how to enjoy myself again.I recommend the movie North Country it is a awesome strong chic flick about women just being tough and taking care of business i know Julie would love it we have so much in common I am sure that movies will give her some time to relax and enjoy herself with out having to put much effort into anything and she is realy still in w/d right now so try it if you guys just want to do something fun together it is a real treat for me mom and I go to the dollar srore and get all of our favorie candy and a couple of drinks and just have a blast.Well I have to go get ready for work I hope you all have a great day !!! I will definitely be checking in when I get home this afternoon to see how your day has progressed Love both of you so much sending big (((((((((((((HUGS)))))))))))))) : ) Cristina
Good deal I am glad that she is doing good this morning maybe you guys can rest around the house one day this week.I would suggest maybe you ladies go to the matinee or something mom and I really enjoy going to movies together when Arielle is not home it is really nice for us to have that time to be together without really feeling like we have to talk you know anyway it is just a suggestion to get Julies mind off of everything else for a little while when I was using I never went to the movies that is something you just do not do when you are getting high and I had to do things to learn how to enjoy myself again.I recommend the movie North Country it is a awesome strong chic flick about women just being tough and taking care of business i know Julie would love it we have so much in common I am sure that movies will give her some time to relax and enjoy herself with out having to put much effort into anything and she is realy still in w/d right now so try it if you guys just want to do something fun together it is a real treat for me mom and I go to the dollar srore and get all of our favorie candy and a couple of drinks and just have a blast.Well I have to go get ready for work I hope you all have a great day !!! I will definitely be checking in when I get home this afternoon to see how your day has progressed Love both of you so much sending big (((((((((((((HUGS)))))))))))))) : ) Cristina
ctink--thanks for 'splaining. I didn't even think of the obvious reason because I didn't have that needle desire myself. Although there were times that if i had had a needle full of dope when I needed it, I would have shot it directly into my heart to stop the pain.
After a few days, it would probably not matter anyhow-(the naloxone), and why put her at risk (of shooting it), when she is feeling better-duh ;).
Hopefully the needle craving goes away just like all the other craving goes away?
After a few days, it would probably not matter anyhow-(the naloxone), and why put her at risk (of shooting it), when she is feeling better-duh ;).
Hopefully the needle craving goes away just like all the other craving goes away?
Hi, CPVon,
My son was told to take his dose all at one time...no chipping away. Also, I wanted to let you know that from what he said they don't taste good at ALL so it can turn your stomach. Wetting your mouth before placing it under the tongue to make it dissolve faster makes sense to me. And like everyone said...IT IS USELESS IF SWALLOWED instead of dissolving under the tongue. I'm glad it went better (without nausea) this morning!
Love,
Susan
My son was told to take his dose all at one time...no chipping away. Also, I wanted to let you know that from what he said they don't taste good at ALL so it can turn your stomach. Wetting your mouth before placing it under the tongue to make it dissolve faster makes sense to me. And like everyone said...IT IS USELESS IF SWALLOWED instead of dissolving under the tongue. I'm glad it went better (without nausea) this morning!
Love,
Susan
Hey guys, gosh, I must be brain dead , I just understood the whole difference between suboxone, and subutex, you can shoot subutex, correct? and that effect could kill you right? ha ha ha. I must have read and re read im on it too's post two or three times, before I realized that Christina mentioned that I prefer iv, it still didnt hit me, the im on it too came back with the same revelation I did, that they are worried i am going to try to switch my meds, so I can shoot them. Wow, that would be a dope fiend move, now wouldnt it Christina? Yeah, I will admit to the sick pleasure of missing the needle, but screw that, I value my life way way too much to even consider picking up one of those damn things again.
"Im on it too" I wish you would tell me your name, it could make it easier to communicate with you, I am Julie. 31 year old single mom of a 12 year old, just your adverage junkie trying to grab hold of life. As a matter of fact, I dont even like that word anymore, junkie I mean, how about.......woman, yes, I likw that better, I am just your average woman, trying to grab hold of a better life. Any how, thank you very much for caring enough to respond to me, somettimes I feel I am handled with "kid gloves" and it is refreshing to feel free to write what I am honestly feeling, without reprocussions from anyone "else" on this board who also has my mothers feelings to worry about. God bless my mom, dont know what I would do with out her. Anyhow, thanks, alot, and I truely mean it.julie
"Im on it too" I wish you would tell me your name, it could make it easier to communicate with you, I am Julie. 31 year old single mom of a 12 year old, just your adverage junkie trying to grab hold of life. As a matter of fact, I dont even like that word anymore, junkie I mean, how about.......woman, yes, I likw that better, I am just your average woman, trying to grab hold of a better life. Any how, thank you very much for caring enough to respond to me, somettimes I feel I am handled with "kid gloves" and it is refreshing to feel free to write what I am honestly feeling, without reprocussions from anyone "else" on this board who also has my mothers feelings to worry about. God bless my mom, dont know what I would do with out her. Anyhow, thanks, alot, and I truely mean it.julie
Never my intent to offend you and I am truly soory if I did I have wanted nothing but good things for you and hope that if you were offended you will forgive me .Thanks for listening Cristina
Ya know what? I dont think I was really offended, but I did feel kind of funny about it, maybe just because I still have that addict mind, its also kind of weird watching people try to decide whats best for you on a computer screen. I also appologize, I think I may have reacted a little "catty" I truely do want to better, and it has always been hard for me to trust people, especially other women, honestly Chris, Ive always just been one of the guys, but in my heart, I would like to be friends, so please, lets just "fuh getta bout it". How was your daughters gymnastics thing???? Love you. Julie
I totally understand and i ahve always been the same way always a chic hater when I was using because they threatened me in some way get my share of drugs some stupid bs like that you know,anyway I guess you are not used to the board in thatway that if you post for some advice you sure do get it!!! I actually got in a fight with this woman on the board one night because she told your mom to call the law on you and I stayed up until like 4 in the morning back and forth with that biotch anyway I have already let that go i ll tell you the post sometime as they are all here.I am friends with your mom and I started 2 different post for the sole reason to give you a little privacy and even emailed your mom and asked her to try not to read them as you may want to share some personal things trust that every thing I have done is too help you not hurt you and have consistantly given your mom advice not from just a friens point of view but also an addict because that is what I am before I AM cristina that defines me first and if I forget that I am surely destined to fail.I say that because I have to remember everyday that before i am unique i am one of many trying to deal with life with a seriously warped mind you know Please dont ever fell i would try to put you down or make you feel less than I have been your biggest cheerleader(UGHH) besides your mom and i am serious I want more than you can even imagine for you to get the gift i have recieved as a result from doing the sub program whole heartedly when I say I love you i mean it and that is all I can say iwant this foyou as much as I want it for myself .Got to go walk Arielle s dog be right back and we can talk some more if youlike glad to see you on the board aint so bad is it\?: ) Cristina
Now I gotta cook dinner yipeee! I get so irratated sometimes having to do all this stuff when I would rather be doing what I want to do but that just the kinda thinkin that got me in trouble so Ill be back after Arielle eats dinner where did you go?
Just saw the posts on Subutex versus Suboxone. Clearly Julie is on Suboxone for all the right reasons.
There is no difference between Subutex and Suboxone when taken under the tongue. In both cases, you are only taking the drug Buprenorphine.
The Naloxone in Suboxone is not absorbed at all so just forget about it. It only kicks in if its is IV'd or injected intramuscularly.
There is no difference between Subutex and Suboxone when taken under the tongue. In both cases, you are only taking the drug Buprenorphine.
The Naloxone in Suboxone is not absorbed at all so just forget about it. It only kicks in if its is IV'd or injected intramuscularly.
Julie--I'm glad you cracked a smile :)! I can't tell you my name 'cause I'm way too paranoid! I will tell you that I'm a mom too, and I have been a single mom before.
(I'm not sure which is worse!--being single or not),
And, I can admit that I'm a junkie too, but I hate being called one--or maybe it's just the way it was said when someone called me that, but that's a whole other story...
I've been rooting for you too, just like ctink---but ctink actually believed that you would make it home, I only hoped that you would take that chance, but I wasn't so sure that you would make it.
I actually found a way to abuse the suboxone--I experimented, I won't bother saying what I did, but it was something that someone had posted online, and I was sorry as hell!
I really should have known better since the time that I followed step-by-step illustrated instructions on the www, on how to clean my keyboard by taking it completely apart, and that keyboard never worked again.
Right now, I'm in a really respectfull place with the medicine, I've been taking it for a few months, and it is a life-saver for me.
So, when i screwed-up with it, doing things you're not supposed to do, then having to start all over again, I could only thank-God that it worked again, but I don't know how many miracle last chances I'm gonna get!
That's why I actually like the idea that they force you not to shoot the stuff by putting nasty stuff in it---once you don't crave the relief that the needle brings, I guess you won't think about the shot as much?
And yeah--i had to tell my doctor what happened but I figured-he knows he's working with junkies here, I'm sure he can handle the truth, so why bother stressing over it?
Sometimes I don't even visit support groups online unless I am working on a personal problem--I just live a pretty normal life, since my last scare, I guess I needed to check-in with fellow subbies to see how people are doing & keep an eye on my own use of the medicine.
Maybe I'm gearing-up for the goal that I had of weening-off or tapering down from the stuff, but that idea kind of flew-off when my doctors said that I could stay on it awhile. -or I just need to be around other people who are working hard to beat the addict in their heads.--and letting us know when we're full of u-no-what!
But, I'm trying to stay at as low a level as possible--still taking regular doses as perscibed, without any cravings or desires to use narcotics--or to get high.
I could probably cut-back at this point, but I am afraid of becoming fatigued & depressed. -And I keep making excuses to not cut back yet.
But--I am following the doctor's instructions, so i'm at least doing that!
I hope you are having a great time enjoying life without that horrendous habit!
(I'm not sure which is worse!--being single or not),
And, I can admit that I'm a junkie too, but I hate being called one--or maybe it's just the way it was said when someone called me that, but that's a whole other story...
I've been rooting for you too, just like ctink---but ctink actually believed that you would make it home, I only hoped that you would take that chance, but I wasn't so sure that you would make it.
I actually found a way to abuse the suboxone--I experimented, I won't bother saying what I did, but it was something that someone had posted online, and I was sorry as hell!
I really should have known better since the time that I followed step-by-step illustrated instructions on the www, on how to clean my keyboard by taking it completely apart, and that keyboard never worked again.
Right now, I'm in a really respectfull place with the medicine, I've been taking it for a few months, and it is a life-saver for me.
So, when i screwed-up with it, doing things you're not supposed to do, then having to start all over again, I could only thank-God that it worked again, but I don't know how many miracle last chances I'm gonna get!
That's why I actually like the idea that they force you not to shoot the stuff by putting nasty stuff in it---once you don't crave the relief that the needle brings, I guess you won't think about the shot as much?
And yeah--i had to tell my doctor what happened but I figured-he knows he's working with junkies here, I'm sure he can handle the truth, so why bother stressing over it?
Sometimes I don't even visit support groups online unless I am working on a personal problem--I just live a pretty normal life, since my last scare, I guess I needed to check-in with fellow subbies to see how people are doing & keep an eye on my own use of the medicine.
Maybe I'm gearing-up for the goal that I had of weening-off or tapering down from the stuff, but that idea kind of flew-off when my doctors said that I could stay on it awhile. -or I just need to be around other people who are working hard to beat the addict in their heads.--and letting us know when we're full of u-no-what!
But, I'm trying to stay at as low a level as possible--still taking regular doses as perscibed, without any cravings or desires to use narcotics--or to get high.
I could probably cut-back at this point, but I am afraid of becoming fatigued & depressed. -And I keep making excuses to not cut back yet.
But--I am following the doctor's instructions, so i'm at least doing that!
I hope you are having a great time enjoying life without that horrendous habit!
Hey Cristina, I have been bouncing all over tarnation looking to find a new post from you, I always forget which darn posts I click on, so I have to pretty much go throught the whole dang board to find our most recent conversations, I started a new one just a few minutes ago, trying to reach out, and make friends. I am glad I met you, and im on it too also, I think I will call her "buddy" is that okay with everybody? I cant blame her for not wanting her name out there, but having something to call her makes it seem more personal to me, hell my name is julie sandra Von!!! I dont want any privacy, by all means, bug me, bug me to death, shower me with your typed words of love...h a ha ha ha ha. Yeah- I am a friggen nut case, I realize that. So anyways, I got your e mail C, man, It really touched me, I am no girly girl either, so when I say that, I really mean it, ya know? I e mailed you back, hope you got it, and its all good. Cris, I keep thinking how weird it is that we have so much in common, I mean damn, from our ages, to our jobs, to cigeretes?? wow, cool, huh? Okay, enough a** kissing, you get the message, I like you, you like me, lets be friends.... ha ha.
"Buddy" (im on it too) I am really glad you shared with me, and I am so glad you were honest about the abuse of the sub, It has crossed my mind, but I havent done it , I know that that past of my life is done, and I am so friggen glad, but I can surely relate to that whole "gotta be a better way" of thinking, I mean, we are drug addicts, any other way of thinking is almost foreighn, ya know? The first thought out of my mindwas, yeah, these pills keep me from being sick, but they dont get me high.....although i do like the nose itching part. ha ha.
write soon. I love you Cris.
"Buddy" (im on it too) I am really glad you shared with me, and I am so glad you were honest about the abuse of the sub, It has crossed my mind, but I havent done it , I know that that past of my life is done, and I am so friggen glad, but I can surely relate to that whole "gotta be a better way" of thinking, I mean, we are drug addicts, any other way of thinking is almost foreighn, ya know? The first thought out of my mindwas, yeah, these pills keep me from being sick, but they dont get me high.....although i do like the nose itching part. ha ha.
write soon. I love you Cris.
Girl you ahve got me jumping all around I havent checked my email yet getting ready to do that now I work in a salon part time and it was CRAZY TODAY I got in my moms car raising he// ill as a hornet but I am starting to calm down now I just dont know how to handle stress to well I guess that is a little further on in recovery one day at a time and I will get there cause there aint no turning back now!!!! Love you too woman!!!! Cristina
