I am going to throw this out there and probably make myself look like an idiot but here goes.
Has anyone ever tried to do a home detox where the addict is actually provided with Heroin and very slowly weaned off over a long period of time by slowly reducing the dose?
Is that even possible? Would being at home with people who loved the addict help or would the addict feel even the slightest reduction in dose and start to protest?
I am guessing this is how rehab works but they try and speed up the process?
I know it would be illegal, risky and hugely expensive but surely living on the streets begging is worse?
Crazy i know but forgive me, i am running out of ideas and my son is spiralling pretty fast and i cant stand back and watch any longer.
I can feel your desperation. And, I understand it.
Although it seems like it would work, I don't think it would in practice. Plus, as you said, you would be putting yourself in legal dilemma for probably no reason.
Will he go to an actual detox place?
Although it seems like it would work, I don't think it would in practice. Plus, as you said, you would be putting yourself in legal dilemma for probably no reason.
Will he go to an actual detox place?
I agree that you can not do detox at home - it sounds practical, but it is not. it would take months. and it is still out of your control. people have posted weaning themselves off suboxone and methadone and pills. I have not heard of someone weaning off H, the proper step is probably off H, and on to something else - like suboxone or methadone. my son tried to stop the combination of stuff he was doing back in April. he was not able to and did not communicate to me what was going on at the time. at one point he said he had not slept in 6 days. he was trying not to use but was not able to sleep and then would use something to sleep like Xanax, he was using H and kalonopin and sleeping meds, and still going to work each day. I realized the situation was too big for him or I to handle on our own. he would not consider over the counter medication - said it does not work ( of course melatonin does not work like a tranquilizer) so he would not cooperate with any at-home care or suggestions.
At one point he had a psychotic episode. kind of slight, kind of confusing. I picked up on it and when I pointed out that he was sending me confusing text messages he said his phone was doing that on its own.... luckily he is not violent. I brought him to my counselor at a recovery center hoping they could talk him into go to the hospital, but for some reason, they kind of backed off and just gave us suggestions about going to the hospital. there were about two days that he did not remember, and then he was back to normal. it was either part of withdrawal or it was some drug he took. a few days after this happened, I opened the oven to cook something and there were two burned slices of pizza in the oven. he could have burned the house down while we were at work or sleeping!
I realized the hospital detox was the only place for him to be. Finally, each time I talked to him I said he needed to go to the hospital. it still took another week before he agreed to go. It was the best decision. they are supervised and medicated appropriately. he was there for 2-3 weeks - first detox and then rehab program. when he came home he was still having trouble sleeping. the dr gave an appropriate medication. over time the medication was changed as his symptoms changed. he continued to go to a recovery center and was doing well until about 90 days sober... he has been slipping, but we don't know to what extent, or if he is going to meetings.....
At one point he had a psychotic episode. kind of slight, kind of confusing. I picked up on it and when I pointed out that he was sending me confusing text messages he said his phone was doing that on its own.... luckily he is not violent. I brought him to my counselor at a recovery center hoping they could talk him into go to the hospital, but for some reason, they kind of backed off and just gave us suggestions about going to the hospital. there were about two days that he did not remember, and then he was back to normal. it was either part of withdrawal or it was some drug he took. a few days after this happened, I opened the oven to cook something and there were two burned slices of pizza in the oven. he could have burned the house down while we were at work or sleeping!
I realized the hospital detox was the only place for him to be. Finally, each time I talked to him I said he needed to go to the hospital. it still took another week before he agreed to go. It was the best decision. they are supervised and medicated appropriately. he was there for 2-3 weeks - first detox and then rehab program. when he came home he was still having trouble sleeping. the dr gave an appropriate medication. over time the medication was changed as his symptoms changed. he continued to go to a recovery center and was doing well until about 90 days sober... he has been slipping, but we don't know to what extent, or if he is going to meetings.....
detox is usually 7 days. they monitor the person and give medication as needed for what they are going thru. high blood pressure and insomnia are problems, and psycosis and probably other complications. your son might have other medical complications, infections, virus, things associated with not taking care of yourself, poor diet and hygiene. I think my son gained 20 lbs in 3 weeks at the hospital.
Thanks for your replies and not condeming me as a reckless father.
On the face of it logic tells me it should work but it would still take will power and the person wanting to stop. I have no doubt whatsoever that the lies would start from day one and my son would artificially inflate his claimed daily intake so he could have more to begin with.
It would take months too but thats the only way i could see it working.
I am not a medical expert but surely one of the reasons detox programs dont give lasting results is that they dont allow enough time for the body and mind to fully adjust (the patient is still reliant on a medication of some sort which is defeating the object) whereas its possible that a long and slow enough taper would let the body return to a more natural state.
If i had more money and it wasnt illegal i would try it for sure and thats probably the same reason we havent heard of anyone quiting this way before.
I just feel it could work. Leaving them out on the street just seems crazy to me.
On the face of it logic tells me it should work but it would still take will power and the person wanting to stop. I have no doubt whatsoever that the lies would start from day one and my son would artificially inflate his claimed daily intake so he could have more to begin with.
It would take months too but thats the only way i could see it working.
I am not a medical expert but surely one of the reasons detox programs dont give lasting results is that they dont allow enough time for the body and mind to fully adjust (the patient is still reliant on a medication of some sort which is defeating the object) whereas its possible that a long and slow enough taper would let the body return to a more natural state.
If i had more money and it wasnt illegal i would try it for sure and thats probably the same reason we havent heard of anyone quiting this way before.
I just feel it could work. Leaving them out on the street just seems crazy to me.
Hi Jet, you are correct, the taper method does work. but the person has to be determined to stick to the schedule. I don't think it is done using H. So sorry you are going thru this. It is absolutely gut wrenching, heart breaking. talk to your son about going to a local hospital detox and rehab. tell him it will give him a break, a chance to relax , rest and reboot.
Thanks.
I need to try harder to connect with my son again but ever since i stopped giving him money he just doesnt want to know, he is always too busy begging. I cant believe how quickly the days and weeks seem to go by. I only see him regulaly about once per month now. He is almost impossible to contact in between but i will make another effort to persuade him to go for rehab.i mentioned it before but he said he didnt want it.
Apparently he was also offered this a few months back but he turned it down. Not suprising as its been a long hot summer and he got plenty of money begging. But the winter is fast approaching and it will change everything, he will be begging on cold wet streets.
I think it was too soon. He was still self medicating over the loss and break up of his own young family, kept telling me he didnt deserve to be better. Maybe he will be more ready as he starts to emotionally heal.
My son has always been the same, you can advise him but he never listens and instead mostly does the polar opposite of what you want him to do. Even when he knows its for his own good he wont choose it. He always used to say to me that he had to learn the hard way and as a result he has put himself through hell and although mostly his own fault he has put himself through more than a lifetimes pain and heartbreak.
I hate what he has done but also feel desperately sorry for him too.
Incidentaly i am pleased to hear your son has completed rehab, although still worrying it must be a huge relief to know he is safe.
I need to try harder to connect with my son again but ever since i stopped giving him money he just doesnt want to know, he is always too busy begging. I cant believe how quickly the days and weeks seem to go by. I only see him regulaly about once per month now. He is almost impossible to contact in between but i will make another effort to persuade him to go for rehab.i mentioned it before but he said he didnt want it.
Apparently he was also offered this a few months back but he turned it down. Not suprising as its been a long hot summer and he got plenty of money begging. But the winter is fast approaching and it will change everything, he will be begging on cold wet streets.
I think it was too soon. He was still self medicating over the loss and break up of his own young family, kept telling me he didnt deserve to be better. Maybe he will be more ready as he starts to emotionally heal.
My son has always been the same, you can advise him but he never listens and instead mostly does the polar opposite of what you want him to do. Even when he knows its for his own good he wont choose it. He always used to say to me that he had to learn the hard way and as a result he has put himself through hell and although mostly his own fault he has put himself through more than a lifetimes pain and heartbreak.
I hate what he has done but also feel desperately sorry for him too.
Incidentaly i am pleased to hear your son has completed rehab, although still worrying it must be a huge relief to know he is safe.
Hi Jet - again I want to tell you - you are not alone. quick note to tell you - my son did 90 days sober. baby steps. 1-2 months in IOP, meetings every night, meeting new people, staying away from the old people, dr appmnts, he began golfing again, going to the gym, we got an old car running. 3rd month - he was working again and still going to IOP and meetings. Then, it changed. 90 days - he thought he deserved a break. it is the month 2 of his friends died 2 yrs ago. I guess it was enough for him to have a few drinks which turned into more. gradually over past 3-4 weeks he has become more distant, wrecked the car after drinking and I found an rx for amphetamine salts (aderal?) luckily no one was involved in the accident, so we can keep it out of insurance problems. and the night he wrecked the car he texted us saying - don't worry, I am staying at someone's house. and it was the date of his best friend's death. today he got a letter in the mail from the recovery center saying he tested positive for alcohol 4 times in a row and has been dismissed from treatment. he can restart if he wants to. also, he has a dui pending that he has been handling himself with a public defender. not a driving dui. he was sleeping in the car and had various pills not in proper container. he is weeks away from possibly getting it dropped. and now he decides to sabotage himself.
this week he has not come home except to shower once. we think he is still working. I both wish he was here, and glad when he's not. except idk when he will be walking in. good part is that he is not home to ask for $. I completely understand what you are going thru. my son was so close to 'normal' all he has to do is not put drugs in his mouth. why is that so hard ( sigh)
I really feel like the alcohol and whatever drugs make him feel all the anxiety and depression. I think when he is sober, the worst thing is that he is 'bored' but he was hanging out with new people most nights... maybe that was part of it, going to sleep late and then need the (Adderall) for a pick up. the rx was from a dr so he was able to talk someone into prescribing it.
I have been into alternative medicine for 30 years. I know it would help my son, but he does not stay sober long enough for anything to work.
as everyone else has said - we dusted him off, polished him up, sent him out.... and he fell down the rabbit hole again.
** same as you said - he is not home long enough to have a discussion about going back to hospital. he will just deny everything any way.
husband and I are just so tired of this being our 'main event' everyday. my husband keeps working more so he does not have to be home, and to try to keep ahead of the curve financially. as we know our son will cost us more $$ some how....
giving up is easier said than done. even though I dream of sea side escape, logistically it isn't going to happen for a few years.
this week he has not come home except to shower once. we think he is still working. I both wish he was here, and glad when he's not. except idk when he will be walking in. good part is that he is not home to ask for $. I completely understand what you are going thru. my son was so close to 'normal' all he has to do is not put drugs in his mouth. why is that so hard ( sigh)
I really feel like the alcohol and whatever drugs make him feel all the anxiety and depression. I think when he is sober, the worst thing is that he is 'bored' but he was hanging out with new people most nights... maybe that was part of it, going to sleep late and then need the (Adderall) for a pick up. the rx was from a dr so he was able to talk someone into prescribing it.
I have been into alternative medicine for 30 years. I know it would help my son, but he does not stay sober long enough for anything to work.
as everyone else has said - we dusted him off, polished him up, sent him out.... and he fell down the rabbit hole again.
** same as you said - he is not home long enough to have a discussion about going back to hospital. he will just deny everything any way.
husband and I are just so tired of this being our 'main event' everyday. my husband keeps working more so he does not have to be home, and to try to keep ahead of the curve financially. as we know our son will cost us more $$ some how....
giving up is easier said than done. even though I dream of sea side escape, logistically it isn't going to happen for a few years.
Maybe you can go to the detox and rehab centers and gather pamphlets to give your son and the local hotline number. if he puts it in his pocket, he may think about it. If you give him the pamphlets a dozen time, maybe he will call a number. I am sure in the condition your son is in he can not think at all. if you want to keep trying, keep giving him the information over and over.
pick him up, give him a sandwich and drink, drive to the hospital parking lot. say - we can sit here while you eat. when you are done you can go in or I can bring you back to where I found you.
idk - it is a ballsy move -- fear of the unknown at that level freaks me out!
I was a wreck getting my son to the hospital back in may) and he actually said he wanted to go. the two weeks before that were scary too. luckily, my son is not violent. the only one time he was violent was last winter when he was taking sleeping pills.
** we have all grown to dislike holidays -- my son is probably feeling the depression of that coming up... winter, cold, 'no friends' or 'gf', holidays that we don't want to be at but must keep up with....
** this is about the time of year I wish I could fast forward to January 1st!
pick him up, give him a sandwich and drink, drive to the hospital parking lot. say - we can sit here while you eat. when you are done you can go in or I can bring you back to where I found you.
idk - it is a ballsy move -- fear of the unknown at that level freaks me out!
I was a wreck getting my son to the hospital back in may) and he actually said he wanted to go. the two weeks before that were scary too. luckily, my son is not violent. the only one time he was violent was last winter when he was taking sleeping pills.
** we have all grown to dislike holidays -- my son is probably feeling the depression of that coming up... winter, cold, 'no friends' or 'gf', holidays that we don't want to be at but must keep up with....
** this is about the time of year I wish I could fast forward to January 1st!
Holidays are always difficult and I have to put "on my happy face" so my elderly hubby and disabled 17 y/o enjoy them. Can't let my addicted son steal their thunder!!
I still miss and wonder daily about him. My heart keeps saying"take him food and clothing at Christmas", but my head says "no way" -- you will just be living with all the drama again!
His ex-gf messaged me the other day and said that my son messaged her. He told her he was barely making it and had nothing. Sent her a pic of one of his dogs. In the pic I could see my son's legs and feet and they were very dirty and made me cry. Moms hate to see this sort of thing and last time I saw him --he looked horrible, thin, dirty, and pathetically sad. I know he has to want to change if he ever has a chance, but I am losing hope as he nears his 48th birthday.
Praying for a miracle!
Lori
I still miss and wonder daily about him. My heart keeps saying"take him food and clothing at Christmas", but my head says "no way" -- you will just be living with all the drama again!
His ex-gf messaged me the other day and said that my son messaged her. He told her he was barely making it and had nothing. Sent her a pic of one of his dogs. In the pic I could see my son's legs and feet and they were very dirty and made me cry. Moms hate to see this sort of thing and last time I saw him --he looked horrible, thin, dirty, and pathetically sad. I know he has to want to change if he ever has a chance, but I am losing hope as he nears his 48th birthday.
Praying for a miracle!
Lori
Hi Lori - it is so sad. I wish there were places for them to live minimally and receive the medical care they need. when ever I think it through the logistics of social services and all of the services that would be involved and their own effort to stay with the program is too much for them and for the community. people in your son's situation should be considered disabled and receive government care. someday maybe he will. living this life is so emotional. it makes us into strong people. those who have not gone thru it cant imagine what it is like. I am glad I have this board to come to. I would be so much more alone without it.
thank you for sharing.
thank you for sharing.
