Stuff sometimes just creeps up on you, out of the blue & it makes no sense. What is it then when ur chippin or not using at all, that makes u take something even when u know its not gonna work like u want & right after u do it u regret it & you dont even get a pleasant high, like the 2nd or 3rd or 4th day on crummy generics, but u still go & use. Its no longer a thing of feeling good, its the hope that u might get lucky & at best maybe 2 minutes of pleasure but it ends up being more dysphoric then euphoric & u should have never started chipping to begin with. This is absolute insanity. I even remember times when doing this were i was glad there weren't that many more left so i could stop, but when i had em i couldn't.
I've always had a hard time with the concept of addiction as a disease (i thought that was making excuses) but if not a disease it sure is surrounded with self idiocy- at least in my case.
& what really is almost bizzare, when things are tough & i have my back sort of to the wall with financial or other types of problems, i have little chance of relapse or occasional use- even though i'm under major stress. I fight, get back on my feet, start seeing a bright future , feel happy & almost instantly, no matter how much clean time i have, the idea of deserving a treat, since i have overcome, is overwhelming & i almost always, as long as i can remember, at least for a little while, start to use & even when clean , it remains in my mind as a viable option.
Last serious time, which mostly ended a few months ago, i thought i had been only using for a little while, like a couple months, until someone told me that I had been using steadily since I knew them, almost a year & 1/2.
Am I rambeling or is there a thread here?
I know everyones gonna lecture me on NA (if possible pretend u already did). I'd sure like to hear what anyone has to say, thanx & have a healthy living day.
Browndog, I've only been clean a couple of months and the first thing that pops into my head when I wake up every morning is "Damn, I don't do pills anymore, how am I going to get through this day?" Now, isn't that messed up? But I do get through the day and every day I get through, I get stronger. I wish there was some way to get these darn pills out of my head! I get so tired of fighting. And I, too, sometimes think, Well, I deserve a pill because I've been so good! But I know better than that....one will lead to 20 a day and I won't even see it coming!! Hang in there. You're not stupid, we all think and do things that we don't want to. You just have to stay strong and keep going.
Brown,
I wasnt going to post, if fact I havent for quite a while... but I have been thinking about your post and thought well I would make an exception given our 'history' lol...
First let me say... you know my thoughts on NA... so I will do you a favor and not rehash that..except to say.... there is a reason that so many of us are successful and HAPPY doing it... but...
As far as those darn things not working anymore but our brains not getting that message and still wanting to do it anyway... well that my friend is just part of the disease... yes the disease... I also thought for a while that to say that was an exuse and rationalization for my using.. 'oh poor me it is genetics my dad is an alcoholic and it is well a disease too'... I used to deep down think... 'I know that is a lot of bullsh*t but hea it sounds good'... but then when I went into treatment and got educated about it .. I learned that for most of us that develope this as a disease the chemical dependancy gets intertwined with a little part of our brain that developed many centuries ago... It is called the pain/ pleasure - survival center... This all work in the same area and it tells us when to eat to survive .. that we need to seek shelter ... that we need to have sex to further the species.. ect... it is very carnal and very basic... It is the most powerful area in the brain... The need for these drugs become tied up with this center .. and our craving are like this area telling us subconsciously that... if we dont get our drug we will die... It is crazy but it is how it works... This has been tested and proven on a funcional MRI scan with cocaine addicts... But I degress... anyhoo...
I am not saying that we have no control .. after we are out of the fog and clean we most certainly have control and should be expected to exercise it. .. and held accountable for any poor judgement but because of the way the chemical physical component and the mental process are so intertwined it is to be expected that issues are going to pop up and relapses or at lest the strong possiblity of them are alway present....
That is why it takes more than going through withdrawl or avoiding them as some seem so intent on doing... and then just going about there lives..to stay clean.. it just is not that simple ... an addict simply has got to have a program of some sort..counseling (if you go to a therapist that isnt your type find another one) go to an NA meeting ( if you go to a meeting with a bunch of old people or you have other issues with it... find another one..) gets some outside support.... tell your suppliers and/or your docs.... get rid or any and alll reservations... get it through that you can NEVER use again no matter what.... you do NOT have control over drugs they control you... you ARE powerless ... if you can not get these things inside your head and really believe them... deep down in your gut... then you will relapse again and again... I know it ....
I hope this doesnt make you angry with me... But I know it because I lived it... I have seen others live it and die from it... and I care enough about you and those that might be reading this to say it...
I hope I am not being too harsh but as I said I am only saying it because I care...
God Bless.
Teresa
I wasnt going to post, if fact I havent for quite a while... but I have been thinking about your post and thought well I would make an exception given our 'history' lol...
First let me say... you know my thoughts on NA... so I will do you a favor and not rehash that..except to say.... there is a reason that so many of us are successful and HAPPY doing it... but...
As far as those darn things not working anymore but our brains not getting that message and still wanting to do it anyway... well that my friend is just part of the disease... yes the disease... I also thought for a while that to say that was an exuse and rationalization for my using.. 'oh poor me it is genetics my dad is an alcoholic and it is well a disease too'... I used to deep down think... 'I know that is a lot of bullsh*t but hea it sounds good'... but then when I went into treatment and got educated about it .. I learned that for most of us that develope this as a disease the chemical dependancy gets intertwined with a little part of our brain that developed many centuries ago... It is called the pain/ pleasure - survival center... This all work in the same area and it tells us when to eat to survive .. that we need to seek shelter ... that we need to have sex to further the species.. ect... it is very carnal and very basic... It is the most powerful area in the brain... The need for these drugs become tied up with this center .. and our craving are like this area telling us subconsciously that... if we dont get our drug we will die... It is crazy but it is how it works... This has been tested and proven on a funcional MRI scan with cocaine addicts... But I degress... anyhoo...
I am not saying that we have no control .. after we are out of the fog and clean we most certainly have control and should be expected to exercise it. .. and held accountable for any poor judgement but because of the way the chemical physical component and the mental process are so intertwined it is to be expected that issues are going to pop up and relapses or at lest the strong possiblity of them are alway present....
That is why it takes more than going through withdrawl or avoiding them as some seem so intent on doing... and then just going about there lives..to stay clean.. it just is not that simple ... an addict simply has got to have a program of some sort..counseling (if you go to a therapist that isnt your type find another one) go to an NA meeting ( if you go to a meeting with a bunch of old people or you have other issues with it... find another one..) gets some outside support.... tell your suppliers and/or your docs.... get rid or any and alll reservations... get it through that you can NEVER use again no matter what.... you do NOT have control over drugs they control you... you ARE powerless ... if you can not get these things inside your head and really believe them... deep down in your gut... then you will relapse again and again... I know it ....
I hope this doesnt make you angry with me... But I know it because I lived it... I have seen others live it and die from it... and I care enough about you and those that might be reading this to say it...
I hope I am not being too harsh but as I said I am only saying it because I care...
God Bless.
Teresa
Teresa,I just read your post and you are right on the money. I take 1 vic a day and have been doing this on and off for yrs. It's just a bandaid on my emotional pain. It seems I am so selfish,take the pill instead of dealing like other people do. I have Lupus and was given a Rx for vics. And now I have a "LEGIT" reason to use. That actually makes me happy. I find that very sick.I am on other meds for the Lupus and joint pain. Once I get it under control I am going to try to stop the vics for good. After all these yrs of having my little back up I am scared to death to stop. The physical w/d is not what concerns me it is the mental w/d. I will find a n/a meeting. I went to alanon when I was going thru my divorce. Ex is a alcholic. Anyway it was very helpful. Thanks for your post. Excuse Girl
exuse girl,
making this decision is a very courageous thing .... please make no mistake about that.. and you are sooo not alone in this battle... many many more have gone before you and sadly many more will follow..
a word or advise.. make a plan now... make a commitment now... as you know you have a medical condition that may require pain management.. try to plan for other contingencies... give some thought to what else you could do for stress reduction as I know that stress can make you medical condition worse and bring on an attack...
my point is I know that you can do this .... start now and make plans get meeting schedules ... even though you werent using much at all the test is the reason you were using it...
Good luck...
making this decision is a very courageous thing .... please make no mistake about that.. and you are sooo not alone in this battle... many many more have gone before you and sadly many more will follow..
a word or advise.. make a plan now... make a commitment now... as you know you have a medical condition that may require pain management.. try to plan for other contingencies... give some thought to what else you could do for stress reduction as I know that stress can make you medical condition worse and bring on an attack...
my point is I know that you can do this .... start now and make plans get meeting schedules ... even though you werent using much at all the test is the reason you were using it...
Good luck...
hey browndog, I know just where your comming from, most of my relapses have been when Im feeling great. In 2001 i did an Ibogain treatment in st kitts and after a couple days of severe withdrawls I was fine this lasted for several month till one day ( feeling great) I thought that if I didnt go see my pain dr. soon he will wonder what happen to me and incase I decided to use in the future he wouldnt be available Now thats insane so I stopped by and got an rx for hydros sicerely thinking I would just keep them around and JUST take 1 or 2 a day if needed . Well needless to say this lasted almost 3 weeks (surprised it wasnt sooner )then I was back where I started. Again I would suggest you get that book the tao of sobriety. For people like my self who since the age of 14 started using quaaludes in miami I never learned the normal way to handle any emotion. so its not surpriseing that even when I get clean Im not used to feeling so good and or unconciously feel the bottom is going to drop out soon so I better score just incase. There is no rationality to it it is totally insane. again disease or not I never went through the normal socilization process of dealing with life and the emotions brought on by it . Yes My dad put me down daily for the way I talked,walked laughed you name it so I was already programmed to feel like a peice of sh-t since early on that something was inherently wrong with me as a human being and when I found that first high that took my pain away its no wonder I got hooked. like the previous poster mentioned therapy of some kind might help reading spiritual books etc. Just wanted to let you know I understand exactly how you feel and your absolutly right it makes no scence, but stay with it if your like me with the low self sesteem and felings of inherent worthlessness we need to reprogram ourselves to feel differently and that book is definetly helping me . There were times when I had over a year clean and feeling great went to the dr. for meds, My gut always felt like I was going to puke because inside I knew what I was doing was wrong but it didnt matter. Hang in there best wishes Ray
Dog, welcome to the disease of addiction, my friend. You could be me...
I am reading the Tao of Sobriety, and it is helping a little. It makes sense that we want to alter our states, mine usually contiually sucks big time, unless I make a consious effort otherwise..
Hang in there. Just keep trudging on the road of happy destiny. Something has to really shift inside, or we will keep going back to the way it was, because at least there was 2 minutes of joy...
I am on the same trek as you, and it is good to post your feelings..
keeps me sane, anyway. LOL. Reminds me that I am not alone in this f***ed up thinking of mine...
Kerry
I am reading the Tao of Sobriety, and it is helping a little. It makes sense that we want to alter our states, mine usually contiually sucks big time, unless I make a consious effort otherwise..
Hang in there. Just keep trudging on the road of happy destiny. Something has to really shift inside, or we will keep going back to the way it was, because at least there was 2 minutes of joy...
I am on the same trek as you, and it is good to post your feelings..
keeps me sane, anyway. LOL. Reminds me that I am not alone in this f***ed up thinking of mine...
Kerry
Hey Ramon, a lot of what u say & ur history reminds me a lot of myself. I almost always, though using, kept myself in working, normal society & tried (ususally succesfully i thought, but not as succesful as i thought) to blend the 2 together, ya know, being a working career oriented family man who made money & used. And man do i know what u mean about finding a reason to get something for emergency just in case there might be some vague emergency. (i think i mentioned my last mini relapse a few mos back when i bought all the 10mg mdose someone was selling cause they were cheep & i could save them for an emergency whicch mustve begun minutes after i picked em up) Do you notice we never ask ourselves, what the F kind of emergency we are preparing for. I mean like whats gonna happen, one day we are just going to walk in our house and suddenly realize we are in intractable pain & its a good thing we have our emergency pills. I consider myself as having at leas some intelligence, so youd think after all this time how on earth could i bs myself with that emergency nonsense, but i do & i almost probably believe it when im thinking it.
which Ray leads me to my friend TERESKY (sp ,?) who i hate to admit might be pretty close to being real right. Teresa u really do know a lot of good stuff & i sincerely & honestly appreciate ur support & good advice (and i gotta admit, i love the way u so subtelly snuck that na stuff in, it was a work of art.) But really, I think u are more right then me on this, & i'm guessin that u can see thru my defensiveness & am protecting my isolation which i cherish, hows that for honesty. In spite of all i don't like about some na, overall i do believe it's the probably somewhere i should start attending, cause i gotta admit this John Wayne attitude I got ( i don't need any help, i stand on my own) just ain't gonna work, no matter how long im clean.
Whats up with this Tao stuff & what is Tao. You guys just don't know how much your response means to me tonight. Thanks for the love i feel. God Bless
which Ray leads me to my friend TERESKY (sp ,?) who i hate to admit might be pretty close to being real right. Teresa u really do know a lot of good stuff & i sincerely & honestly appreciate ur support & good advice (and i gotta admit, i love the way u so subtelly snuck that na stuff in, it was a work of art.) But really, I think u are more right then me on this, & i'm guessin that u can see thru my defensiveness & am protecting my isolation which i cherish, hows that for honesty. In spite of all i don't like about some na, overall i do believe it's the probably somewhere i should start attending, cause i gotta admit this John Wayne attitude I got ( i don't need any help, i stand on my own) just ain't gonna work, no matter how long im clean.
Whats up with this Tao stuff & what is Tao. You guys just don't know how much your response means to me tonight. Thanks for the love i feel. God Bless
brown,
I really do wish you well.... thanks for the kind words and taking what I said without harshness....As I said before you are worth it and we are all in the same boat....
What ever plan or program you work.... please keep moving forward... this is a simply choice of life or a slow but a most certain death...
much love and respect..
Teresa
btw.. really didnt mean to 'sneak' the NA stuff in.. it is just a habit..lol *wink*
I really do wish you well.... thanks for the kind words and taking what I said without harshness....As I said before you are worth it and we are all in the same boat....
What ever plan or program you work.... please keep moving forward... this is a simply choice of life or a slow but a most certain death...
much love and respect..
Teresa
btw.. really didnt mean to 'sneak' the NA stuff in.. it is just a habit..lol *wink*
