I am newly married and my husband gave up pot about a year ago - and he says that his personality has changed because the man I met and the man who courted me no longer exists. I am confused because I did not know he was using during our courtship - only found out 6 months into our marriage which is already on the rocks - he is angry all the time and shows no affection or warmth, says he cannot...I am trying hard to understand, but I feel so bad all the time. This is second time around for both of us - we are both 40ish - is there anyone out there who can give me some advice? Thanks
Have you considered marriage counseling? Would he be willing to go?
I'm no doctor, but it sounds like he may be struggling with depression. Speaking of which, would he be willing to see his physician and share these concerns? Does he view this as a problem? Unless he's willing to face this, there may not be much else you can do other than encourage him (in a supportive, non-confrontational manner) to address the problem.
Wishing you the very best......Silverado!
I'm no doctor, but it sounds like he may be struggling with depression. Speaking of which, would he be willing to see his physician and share these concerns? Does he view this as a problem? Unless he's willing to face this, there may not be much else you can do other than encourage him (in a supportive, non-confrontational manner) to address the problem.
Wishing you the very best......Silverado!
this sounds pretty classic to me. If an addict quits using drugs, he beleives he will return to the state of mind of an ordinary person, but he does not. He returns to the state of mind of an addict who has not satisfied his craving for the drugs. In AA, these folks are referred to as "dry drunks" or "whiteknucklers."
Stopping the influx of drugs into the system is a huge sign of a desire to quit [obviously] but for most addicts, it takes more than this to return to a state where we can be contented without the drugs, where the cravings will cease. Until we reach that state of mind, we walk around being restless, irritable, and discontent. There is a solution to this state of "dis-ease," but it involves choices that can only be made by the addict. His loved ones are essentially powerless to intervene.
Good luck. Feel free to ask questions.
August
Stopping the influx of drugs into the system is a huge sign of a desire to quit [obviously] but for most addicts, it takes more than this to return to a state where we can be contented without the drugs, where the cravings will cease. Until we reach that state of mind, we walk around being restless, irritable, and discontent. There is a solution to this state of "dis-ease," but it involves choices that can only be made by the addict. His loved ones are essentially powerless to intervene.
Good luck. Feel free to ask questions.
August
Thank you both. We have started individual and marriage counselling, and it does help - but I only recently (like in the past couple of days!) realised he is an addict - a fact I feel a bit dumb about missing. So the counselling so far has not addressed his addiction because I did not understand that it was a problem. He is depressed, wired, anxious, moody - all the classic signs which I thought were something to do with me (like maybe he regretted marrying me.) He has not admitted he is an addict - and the 'dry drunk' thing is where he is at right now. I think he might be ready to do something about it, but I am not sure how to help him make that step. I know he has to do it on his own, but knowing him, I think he will see it as a sign of weakness - big tough guys can quit on their own right? I took a step for myself and went to an Al-Anon meeting last night - boy did that open my eyes. I live in a small community so there is no Nar-Anon, but the principles are the same. I am working on not feeling bad about something I cannot control. I know that I cannot make him do anything, but I feel like I should let him know that I know he is an addict, and I know he is suffering and I love him and want to help - if he wants it. Any thoughts? Thanks again.
By attending al anon and pursueing counseling, you are probably doing the very best you can for your husband and your marriage. All of the stuff talked about in al anon applies to pot heads as well. I quit using pot by attending AA. Good luck and keep up the good work!
August
August
August, thanks for writing...I am wondering if it is a good idea to suggest that he attend an open NA meeting with me, there is one here on Saturday - I am afraid of offending him by suggesting that he is an addict and could find this beneficial. I also think that if he doesn't admit his problem and begin to deal with it, that I am going to run out of steam - you know, not be able to take his moods and other stuff anymore. Thanks. I am Elizabeth by the way.
Elizabeth, ideally, the decesion to attend NA or AA should be his, and he should attend without you present. The reason for this is that addicts do not respond well to these programs when they arrive under duress. The old saying is that you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him think.
It is a natural reaction of a loved one to try to usher an addict into the doors of NA or AA, and I worry a bit that your efforts might be met with hostility.
If you have a trusted friend that is in NA or AA, you might consider reaching out to that person so that he can be called on by someone who understands the issue from his perspective. If you do not have such a friend, keep hanging out at al anon and you may meet someone.
It is also entirely possible that you can raise this issue in counseling and make the counselor aware of your concern. I also suggest you raise this within the context of your al anon meetings. Please understand that I am out of my depth here. I work with addicts--not their love ones--because I understand where the addict has been. Your new acquaintences in al anon are probably more knowlegleable, so take what I write here with a grain of salt.
I cannot help but note that this person is really trying hard right now, and I think you are making some excellent moves to help support him. While it seems like you might be able to make some suggestions of things he might consider, I would be careful of dragging him kicking and screaming into recovery. I read your note under the other thread, and would not want to see your efforts unravel by letting this fish get away. Reel him in slowly and carefully. Give him time to adjust to the idea that this may be something that can benefit him.
August
It is a natural reaction of a loved one to try to usher an addict into the doors of NA or AA, and I worry a bit that your efforts might be met with hostility.
If you have a trusted friend that is in NA or AA, you might consider reaching out to that person so that he can be called on by someone who understands the issue from his perspective. If you do not have such a friend, keep hanging out at al anon and you may meet someone.
It is also entirely possible that you can raise this issue in counseling and make the counselor aware of your concern. I also suggest you raise this within the context of your al anon meetings. Please understand that I am out of my depth here. I work with addicts--not their love ones--because I understand where the addict has been. Your new acquaintences in al anon are probably more knowlegleable, so take what I write here with a grain of salt.
I cannot help but note that this person is really trying hard right now, and I think you are making some excellent moves to help support him. While it seems like you might be able to make some suggestions of things he might consider, I would be careful of dragging him kicking and screaming into recovery. I read your note under the other thread, and would not want to see your efforts unravel by letting this fish get away. Reel him in slowly and carefully. Give him time to adjust to the idea that this may be something that can benefit him.
August
Thanks August - I appreciate the advice and I will take it with the suggested grain of salt. I know I need to be a bit more patient, after all I am only just starting with Al-Anon - and I feel better already so I naturally want the same for him. I need a bucket full of patience right now - not one of my strong suits - he is hard work.
Thanks again.
Elizabeth
Thanks again.
Elizabeth
Hi August,
Well, I skipped the Al-Anon meeting tonight, kinda wished I had gone, but I had to deal with homework, halloween costumes and other things. I probably could have gone if I made the time. I guess I feel a bit discouraged - HE told me that I was barking up the wrong tree going to Al-Anon because I wasn't going to find any answers there - I disagree, but even so I have been talking myself out of going to the next meeting since that particular wisdom was imparted. HE says he has no problem - and I am confused now and I am doubting myself- I am not sure what I am trying to say, all I know is today was awful, he was in a mood all day, our daughter was in a mood all day and I just need someone to be nice to me (besides the dog!!) Sorry to sound pathetic, but I sense that you understand a lot of stuff...and I need some encouragement. Oh well, that's what you get for being so supportive on here. I know (logically) that nobody can make me feel bad - except for me allowing it - but I do feel bad anyway - if that makes sense. He is not working, not looking very hard for work and we have no money, so I am busy looking for a job - I am a professional but I have not been able to work for a while because I am waiting for a work permit from immigration ( I am new to this country) but I can make money, lots of it, but I am caught between wanting to be understanding and being pissed off because I am taking calls from bill collectors while he is indulging in his moods. I think it is selfish and I don't understand it at all, I am starting to feel like I am doing something wrong...blowing up won't help - so I will just sigh and go off to bed...I should stop venting now...Elizabeth
Well, I skipped the Al-Anon meeting tonight, kinda wished I had gone, but I had to deal with homework, halloween costumes and other things. I probably could have gone if I made the time. I guess I feel a bit discouraged - HE told me that I was barking up the wrong tree going to Al-Anon because I wasn't going to find any answers there - I disagree, but even so I have been talking myself out of going to the next meeting since that particular wisdom was imparted. HE says he has no problem - and I am confused now and I am doubting myself- I am not sure what I am trying to say, all I know is today was awful, he was in a mood all day, our daughter was in a mood all day and I just need someone to be nice to me (besides the dog!!) Sorry to sound pathetic, but I sense that you understand a lot of stuff...and I need some encouragement. Oh well, that's what you get for being so supportive on here. I know (logically) that nobody can make me feel bad - except for me allowing it - but I do feel bad anyway - if that makes sense. He is not working, not looking very hard for work and we have no money, so I am busy looking for a job - I am a professional but I have not been able to work for a while because I am waiting for a work permit from immigration ( I am new to this country) but I can make money, lots of it, but I am caught between wanting to be understanding and being pissed off because I am taking calls from bill collectors while he is indulging in his moods. I think it is selfish and I don't understand it at all, I am starting to feel like I am doing something wrong...blowing up won't help - so I will just sigh and go off to bed...I should stop venting now...Elizabeth
Elizabeth I regularly attend Al Anon meetings. You should not be discouraged from attending AL ANon meetings by anyone, especially if that person is not active in recovery. In my experience active addicts or addicts who refuse to work their recovery hate it when their families members go to AL Anon or Nar Anon because they are afraid of being "found out". They know that AL Anon members will stop enabling their loved ones addiction, they will stop being manipulated, they will stop feeling if they are somehow to blame for the other person addiction and they know you will become a stronger person who is going to make them choose one day.
Hang in there!
Hang in there!
Elizabeth, Silent Partner articulated my thoughts on this much better than I could. On some deep level, attending Al-Anon represents a threat of sorts to him. After all, you would not have a need to go were it not for his bad conduct. By minimizing your need to go, he can stay in denial of his own issues all the longer.
I really understand the idea that life is hectic and it is easy to put off until tomorrow that meeting that should be attended today. I think this comes down to how we prioritize what is important in our lives. I was lucky enough to learn a long time ago that addiction is a family disease and it will destroy a family like a malignant cancer if left unattended. It is the nature of the disease that encourages us to ignore it, to allow it to grow and fester in the darkness, just out of the reach of our immediate attention.
We have to be courageous and steadfast in ignoring the familiar urge to ignore the problem, to cave to the idea that "it is just me." We cannot allow ourselves to be distracted from the singular importance of dealing with this issue. We must ferret out this beast and bring it into the ldaylight.
For me, this meant putting my recovery ahead of everything else in my life for the first year--it came ahead of work, bills, even family, because I realized that I would lose all those things eventually if I did not priortize my recovery in that fashion. For this reason, I found a meeting that started at 7:30AM and that met everyday. I figured if recovery needed to come first in my life, then I should attend a meeting first thing everyday. It also got it out of the way so that I did not lose focus and miss one by putting it off til later. I know others that have located lunch meetings to minimize the impact of the meeting on their daily lives.
"HIS" opinion regarding al anon is what it is. HE is entitled to it. Just don't let that sway you from doing what is right, from doing what you need to do.
Thanks for your words, SP.
August
I really understand the idea that life is hectic and it is easy to put off until tomorrow that meeting that should be attended today. I think this comes down to how we prioritize what is important in our lives. I was lucky enough to learn a long time ago that addiction is a family disease and it will destroy a family like a malignant cancer if left unattended. It is the nature of the disease that encourages us to ignore it, to allow it to grow and fester in the darkness, just out of the reach of our immediate attention.
We have to be courageous and steadfast in ignoring the familiar urge to ignore the problem, to cave to the idea that "it is just me." We cannot allow ourselves to be distracted from the singular importance of dealing with this issue. We must ferret out this beast and bring it into the ldaylight.
For me, this meant putting my recovery ahead of everything else in my life for the first year--it came ahead of work, bills, even family, because I realized that I would lose all those things eventually if I did not priortize my recovery in that fashion. For this reason, I found a meeting that started at 7:30AM and that met everyday. I figured if recovery needed to come first in my life, then I should attend a meeting first thing everyday. It also got it out of the way so that I did not lose focus and miss one by putting it off til later. I know others that have located lunch meetings to minimize the impact of the meeting on their daily lives.
"HIS" opinion regarding al anon is what it is. HE is entitled to it. Just don't let that sway you from doing what is right, from doing what you need to do.
Thanks for your words, SP.
August
Thank you Silent Partner and August. I know what you are saying is true - but sometimes logic does not make it's way to the surface -- and in some ways blocking out the logical thing to do is my way of denial as well. I understand what you are saying about putting recovery first - so I will re-motivate myself to put it back on the top of the list. Anyway, I live in a remote community and Al-Anon meets just once a week - it is a very small group - but I will phone the woman who runs it and talk with her a bit today - she said I could call anytime, so I will take her up on the offer. It seems that maybe I am trying to do what my husband is doing - thinking that I can cope without the support of other people, and I can see that is not going to work very well at this early stage. I will admit that the whole scenario is a bit alien to me -so when he puts doubts in my head I let them take root. Thanks again, I feel better, still confused, but better. Elizabeth
I suspect that part of the Al Anon process involves learning to separate and deal with the addictive patterns in your thinking. It is not uncommon for family members to take on the same patterns of thought as the addict, if for no reason other than to avoid upsetting him.
Silent Partner is a lot better qualified to speak to this than I am, but I do encourage you to break free of that pull of denial and speak to the Al Anon person.
Good luck.
August
Silent Partner is a lot better qualified to speak to this than I am, but I do encourage you to break free of that pull of denial and speak to the Al Anon person.
Good luck.
August
August well said and you are right on the money.
Al Anon takes you through the 12 steps and traditions for two reasons. One is to understand your friend's disease and the other is so you can see where you have taken on the thinking of an addict.
We begin to think we can control our fiends addiction, we are denial about the range of effects their addiction has on us. We neglect important aspects of our life, often impacting on others (friends, employers etc) because we are consimed by addiction and the effect it is having on our lives. We start to listen to the addicts disease and believe that they will be OK when in fact they are doing nothing to aid their recovery.
If you can go to An Al Anon meeting once a week, go. If you dont go because the group is small, it will be one smaller for the next person who fronts up. If you go, the meeting will grow. hang in there and good luck
Al Anon takes you through the 12 steps and traditions for two reasons. One is to understand your friend's disease and the other is so you can see where you have taken on the thinking of an addict.
We begin to think we can control our fiends addiction, we are denial about the range of effects their addiction has on us. We neglect important aspects of our life, often impacting on others (friends, employers etc) because we are consimed by addiction and the effect it is having on our lives. We start to listen to the addicts disease and believe that they will be OK when in fact they are doing nothing to aid their recovery.
If you can go to An Al Anon meeting once a week, go. If you dont go because the group is small, it will be one smaller for the next person who fronts up. If you go, the meeting will grow. hang in there and good luck
Well, I have to say that I am pretty close to packing it in. I did not sign up for this and I resent the hell out of it - I am trying to figure out how I ended up living in this godforsaken remote place with this person who ignores me...and why I have to go to Al-Anon just to keep my sanity intact. I know that I have to take responsibility for myself - and my choices, so I can't blame him for all of it, but don't you think he would at least try to be nice to me?? I came over here from Europe, gave up my job, gave up my whole life to make a life with him, but he lied to me about the drugs. I really love him - which is amazing to me, I am an intelligent woman - why do I love this man?? I guess I need someone to tell me to stay with it, if I leave now it will be the second time I have had my heart broken by the same man. We have a child together. I wish I could understand and I wish he could see how much I love him, because I do, so much that I keep praying and trying - but how much am I supposed to try when it seems to me he is not trying at all. Maybe he is, but I can't see it. All I can see is him indulging in his moods. Alas I am in a state of turmoil - leave now, cut my losses and forever be sad, or stay and be sad - gee what a great choice this is turning out to be. Did I mention that I love this man with all my heart? I am not a teenager, I should be able to be objective, but I am not. Sometimes I am not sure if all these issues are related to the drug thing...or maybe they are...help I am losing my mind here in the back of beyond. Elizabeth
Hi again, I have a question. I had a long talk with my husband about his pot smoking - he said some things which I don't really know are factual, but it does put some doubts in my head. He has not smoked for over a year now, and he said he is only doing it because I made it a condition for us to be together. My feeling (after much soul searching) was to give the decision to quit back in his hands - because I think it should be up to him - and frankly I don't want to take responsibility for whether he stays off it or not. I am not his keeper. The issue is if he wants to start again I don't think I should stand in his way and tell him not to - all I have said so far is that it is his decision, and one only he can make. The question I have is he still insists he was not/is not an addict. He said that when he did smoke it was not very often and only to help him calm down. He told me he has ADD - and smoking now and then slows his brain down so he can think. Watching him I have seen that he is wound up like a top - and he never stops- since he has been off for a year it does not make sense to me that it is because of withdrawal or anything else. I don't want to feel like I am giving him 'permission' because that is not what I am doing (at least I think not) all I want to do is put it all back in his hands - it is his problem to deal with not mine. Does any of this make sense? I have heard of marijuana being used for medicinal purposes, but this could be a stretch...in any case I don't want to tell him what to do...the only thing I have said about it is if he does use, I don't want to see it, smell it or have it in my home. I am not sure if I did the right thing, but I do feel like a weight has been taken off my shoulders....any thoughts? Thanks. Elizabeth
Elizabeth, you asked whether any of his explanations made sense, and frankly speaking as an addict, they sound rather familiar and rather non-sensical. I will warn you in advance that I am an addict and I look at most drug use with a very skeptical eye. I have heard all the justifications and used them all as well. For me, the bottom line is that if he is not addict, quitting would not be a big deal to him. Your mileage may vary, so take what I say with a grain of salt.
If I read your post correctly, he is smoking now in defiance of your condition that he not do so. I do not understand this reasoning. It seems to suggest a rebelliousness that suborns the importance of your relationship to his personal wishes. My working definition of addiction is anything that impairs a persons ability to form and maintain relationships or to function normally.
He says he has not used in over a yearI used to say that too. Sometimes I would be so stoned while saying it that I actually believed it myself.
He insists that he is not an addict"maybe he is; maybe he isnt, but if he is not, quitting would not be a big deal.
He said that when he did smoke it was not very often and only to help him calm down. He told me he has ADD. Smoking to self medicate sounds like the behavior of an addict to me. If ADD were the problem, he should seek appropriate mental health guidance and if necessary obtain a prescription for the appropriate medication. Addicts love to self diagnose and really love to self medicate. FWIW, ADD is treated with stimulants as I understand it, and without question, marijuana is a depressant, so I am skeptical of his analysis.
he is wound up like a top - and he never stops- in AA we refer to this state of being as restless, irritable, and discontent. It is derived from a state of having an obsession to use one's drug of choice. The condition continues even if the person ceases his use unless of course he addresses the emotional aspects of his addiction.
I have heard of marijuana being used for medicinal purposes, but this could be a stretch... Pot is used by cancer patients to increase appetite, and by glaucoma patients to ease difficulties with their eyes. It is not used for ADD, but most pot heads feel it is absolutely necessary to help them maintain an even keel. In my case, it also increased my perception, made my jokes funnier and added 20 to 50 points to my IQ, depending on the quality of the pot.
I will leave it to your own best judgment as to how to deal with this issue. I have no experience to offer from the standpoint of a loved one who is involved with someone with a possible addiction.
Silent Partner often has some good things to say about these issues.
Good luck
August
If I read your post correctly, he is smoking now in defiance of your condition that he not do so. I do not understand this reasoning. It seems to suggest a rebelliousness that suborns the importance of your relationship to his personal wishes. My working definition of addiction is anything that impairs a persons ability to form and maintain relationships or to function normally.
He says he has not used in over a yearI used to say that too. Sometimes I would be so stoned while saying it that I actually believed it myself.
He insists that he is not an addict"maybe he is; maybe he isnt, but if he is not, quitting would not be a big deal.
He said that when he did smoke it was not very often and only to help him calm down. He told me he has ADD. Smoking to self medicate sounds like the behavior of an addict to me. If ADD were the problem, he should seek appropriate mental health guidance and if necessary obtain a prescription for the appropriate medication. Addicts love to self diagnose and really love to self medicate. FWIW, ADD is treated with stimulants as I understand it, and without question, marijuana is a depressant, so I am skeptical of his analysis.
he is wound up like a top - and he never stops- in AA we refer to this state of being as restless, irritable, and discontent. It is derived from a state of having an obsession to use one's drug of choice. The condition continues even if the person ceases his use unless of course he addresses the emotional aspects of his addiction.
I have heard of marijuana being used for medicinal purposes, but this could be a stretch... Pot is used by cancer patients to increase appetite, and by glaucoma patients to ease difficulties with their eyes. It is not used for ADD, but most pot heads feel it is absolutely necessary to help them maintain an even keel. In my case, it also increased my perception, made my jokes funnier and added 20 to 50 points to my IQ, depending on the quality of the pot.
I will leave it to your own best judgment as to how to deal with this issue. I have no experience to offer from the standpoint of a loved one who is involved with someone with a possible addiction.
Silent Partner often has some good things to say about these issues.
Good luck
August
Hi, thanks for writing. Just to clarify he is not smoking now - and I do believe him...I think he wants to, but he hasn't - I want to trust him on that. Even so, I could be wrong, he has lied to me before.
I think I need to get some feedback on how this effects me...whether he is an addict or not...is is really up to me to make that decision for him? He told me it was MY decision and that he why he quit, so I am living with the consequences. I am not dumb, I know justification when I see it. But does this not all just go back to the fact that it is up to him and not me? I felt I needed to let go of that responsibility....but I still think I should set some boundaries, I just don't know what they should be beyond, don't bring it home, don't spend any of my money or the rent money and keep it to yourself. This all sounds a bit insane I know...but I don't want to be the subject of his resentment, I don't want to be his mother...I want him to make his own decisions, then if I don't like whatever that turns out to be I have to decide if I can live with it. The only other option as I can see is to get out now, and I can't see doing that at this point in time.
Well, I am a bit confused...
Elizabeth
I think I need to get some feedback on how this effects me...whether he is an addict or not...is is really up to me to make that decision for him? He told me it was MY decision and that he why he quit, so I am living with the consequences. I am not dumb, I know justification when I see it. But does this not all just go back to the fact that it is up to him and not me? I felt I needed to let go of that responsibility....but I still think I should set some boundaries, I just don't know what they should be beyond, don't bring it home, don't spend any of my money or the rent money and keep it to yourself. This all sounds a bit insane I know...but I don't want to be the subject of his resentment, I don't want to be his mother...I want him to make his own decisions, then if I don't like whatever that turns out to be I have to decide if I can live with it. The only other option as I can see is to get out now, and I can't see doing that at this point in time.
Well, I am a bit confused...
Elizabeth