i must apolagise i did not mean to offend you,i totaly agree that there are bad people in there that have lost their rights and deserve what they get but as myself i went to jail for driving with no mdl and had to detox in there with pretty much no help, mine a crime indeed but the only victim was me of my own stupidity for driving,my adiction had to be dealt with in there was i supposed to suffer because of a stupid bad choice i dont believe i should but only my opinion.so sorry again if i offended you it was not my intention.
yes, my son was jailed because he had drug paraphenalia, my concern is (was) that he was also taking prescribed drugs and they cold turkeyed him off everything until the 5th day when he became so psychotic that they had to call in medical..taxpayers pay for medical in jail..period..if he was a diabetic, had cancer or high blood pressure it would have been addressed immediately, it was because he is a junkie they denied him medical, my opinion, until they start treating people with addictions with some humanity, they will continue to see them time after time (little costly to the taxpayer then?) why not see him mentally degrading, send him to the hospital, get him semi stable then back to jail? I think they only called medical when they did is because they know we would sue the crap out of them if he died..that is a simple fact.. true story, my father in law is a retired deputy sherrif from this same jail..we heard him tell stories through the years that made me sick to my stomache the way they treated inmates..sure there needs to be some seperation of job and inmates but when they become that inhumane and callous, maybe its time to leave the job..not all, just some
You didn't offend me at all..sorry if I gave you that impression. Around here, everyone is welcome to an opinion. That's all they are.
I don't think that someone who breaks a law that doesn't involve hurting anyone else or property should be sent to jail. Driving while drunk is one thing, but being put in jail for driving without a license? Seems stiff to me. Having drug paraphenilia and being sent to jail also seems harsh. I don't get that. Jails are for people who kill, rob, rape,abuse and destroy property. People who are chronic drug users, in my opinion do not belong there. Unless of course they did one of the earlier mentioned things. Again, just my opinion.
I don't think that someone who breaks a law that doesn't involve hurting anyone else or property should be sent to jail. Driving while drunk is one thing, but being put in jail for driving without a license? Seems stiff to me. Having drug paraphenilia and being sent to jail also seems harsh. I don't get that. Jails are for people who kill, rob, rape,abuse and destroy property. People who are chronic drug users, in my opinion do not belong there. Unless of course they did one of the earlier mentioned things. Again, just my opinion.
------> i went to jail for driving with no mdl.
You know I gotta ask right, why didn't you have a mdl?
What I was refering to when I said I disagree with statement everyone in jail is guilty of something was.
Not the addicts there, all thought that's a great discussion as well.
No I was pointing out that here in The Prison Scoeity know as Ric k Perry's monarch or TEXAS.
Everyday an Inmate is released after being cleared of the crime for which they are incarcerrated.
Just sayning.
Joe
You know I gotta ask right, why didn't you have a mdl?
What I was refering to when I said I disagree with statement everyone in jail is guilty of something was.
Not the addicts there, all thought that's a great discussion as well.
No I was pointing out that here in The Prison Scoeity know as Ric k Perry's monarch or TEXAS.
Everyday an Inmate is released after being cleared of the crime for which they are incarcerrated.
Just sayning.
Joe
Yeah Joe everyone (more or less) is in jail because of something illegal- - There are also certain laws that at the very least- need to be looked at, and at best need to be changed.
As Ca and others are starting to see the practical purpose, at least medically for age old MJ laws, it should be looked at on a federal level. There are people who belong in prison, and there are people who are the pawns of a bad system , 1/2 heartily trying to come into the 21st century.
Don't get me wrong, we are responsible for our behavior, but in many cases the local, state ,or feds, get involved .(remember for all the prison system is-> it is also a business)- contracts are constantly bidded on by prisons because of thier cheap labor...etc...
The concern is in thier over zealousness to lock up minor offenders, lives are ruined, families are hurt, when treatment or more progressive ideas are just blatantly ignored.
I dont know if I went off the topic- but it wouldnt be the 1st time- -
best regards - -
jack
As Ca and others are starting to see the practical purpose, at least medically for age old MJ laws, it should be looked at on a federal level. There are people who belong in prison, and there are people who are the pawns of a bad system , 1/2 heartily trying to come into the 21st century.
Don't get me wrong, we are responsible for our behavior, but in many cases the local, state ,or feds, get involved .(remember for all the prison system is-> it is also a business)- contracts are constantly bidded on by prisons because of thier cheap labor...etc...
The concern is in thier over zealousness to lock up minor offenders, lives are ruined, families are hurt, when treatment or more progressive ideas are just blatantly ignored.
I dont know if I went off the topic- but it wouldnt be the 1st time- -
best regards - -
jack
I'm starting to think we are kind of all saying the same thing here in different ways. Bad criminals deserve to be punished, the worse the crime, the harsher the punishment. The problem is what is a "Criminal."
It should be a simple black and white thing. But the powers that be (& those who claim that "We the People" somehow are the ones in power are either liars or maybe completely in fantasy land) have somehow made people criminals because they don't fall within their sense of what is right and more importantly, are not able to protect themselves.
That is why the same laws that send someone to jail for shoplifting allow banks, insurance companys and the like to blatantly rob & treat their customers fraudulantly. Imagine what would happen if, on a dayly basis, instead of someone paying you the $30.00 they owed you, you figured out a way that they had to pay you $300.00. And imagine if you kept doing this on and on and on. You would be stealing. You would be a criminal. Banks do it all the time.
Murderers, rapists, child molesters ---they are evil criminals. They deserve the severest of punishments. In our collective "wisdom & mercy" we have somehow come to the conclusion that it would not be moral to punish them as they deserve. Instead of executing them, we house them.
Their is only one class of "criminals" that is punished worse then them. Drug users who are addicted. What is their crime, if they have done nothing to harm anyone else? They are criminals. Why are they criminals. Because they Use Drugs.
I am so tired of considering how things should be,, and how somehow, the powers that be always seem to end up creating monsters out of victems, and doing it in the name of morality.
It should be a simple black and white thing. But the powers that be (& those who claim that "We the People" somehow are the ones in power are either liars or maybe completely in fantasy land) have somehow made people criminals because they don't fall within their sense of what is right and more importantly, are not able to protect themselves.
That is why the same laws that send someone to jail for shoplifting allow banks, insurance companys and the like to blatantly rob & treat their customers fraudulantly. Imagine what would happen if, on a dayly basis, instead of someone paying you the $30.00 they owed you, you figured out a way that they had to pay you $300.00. And imagine if you kept doing this on and on and on. You would be stealing. You would be a criminal. Banks do it all the time.
Murderers, rapists, child molesters ---they are evil criminals. They deserve the severest of punishments. In our collective "wisdom & mercy" we have somehow come to the conclusion that it would not be moral to punish them as they deserve. Instead of executing them, we house them.
Their is only one class of "criminals" that is punished worse then them. Drug users who are addicted. What is their crime, if they have done nothing to harm anyone else? They are criminals. Why are they criminals. Because they Use Drugs.
I am so tired of considering how things should be,, and how somehow, the powers that be always seem to end up creating monsters out of victems, and doing it in the name of morality.
Hey Now,
I'm with you man.
i have dropped out of the society will one day be fair and just.
i now much more perfer the day of reckoning theroy.
it put's the whole thing in the hands of something that can do something aobut it.
In the mean tine it keeps me free to carry the message you know the one.
If you don't want to use drugs today, you don't have to.
Seems that's my only job, anyway.
Peace
my brother
I'm with you man.
i have dropped out of the society will one day be fair and just.
i now much more perfer the day of reckoning theroy.
it put's the whole thing in the hands of something that can do something aobut it.
In the mean tine it keeps me free to carry the message you know the one.
If you don't want to use drugs today, you don't have to.
Seems that's my only job, anyway.
Peace
my brother
Deadhead, that is a good point & a way to live life that is both practicle and meaningful. I don't know why I have allowed myself to get caught up in this way of thinking. It's always been somewhere around my circle of thought. I do remember several years ago, when I went to see a shrink primarly because I realized I once again had started using regularly (not hard core stuff for the most part, but pills fairly regularly & every now & then hittin oc). He was a good man who I was able to be honest with & I'm pretty certain I never even tried to play him. One thing I really liked the guy is he was smart enough to understand what I was saying & not judge it into something different.
So when he said something directly in response to something I expressed, I was open to it knowing his motives were pure and he was able to understand what I ment. One of the issues I brought up was that I was very offended and bothered by the unjustice of drug laws even though by this point I was not using drugs illegaly and from some points of view (not NA) I was in recovery. He was a supporter of NA & at the same time realized that it was not necessarly the 'only way' for everyone - though he always encouraged me to go to meatings and take from them what I could. When it came to discussing my big concern with drug laws, and its affects on addicts, and the possibility that the laws themselves might be instrumental in getting people addicted or prolonging their addiction when they were trying to stop, HE SUGGESTED THAT HE THOUGHT I WAS GETTING CAUGHT UP IN WHAT NA CALLS 'STINKIN THINKIN.'
I seriously considered what he said and I do believe there was some truth in that. He was at least partially correct. At that point in my life, as right or wrong as I might be about the whole issue, and my frustration with it, was not all that relevant to anything. So part of it was very possible an attempt at self sabotage under the guise of something else, and part of it was a way for me to take my attention off myself & things I needed to work on. Kind of like movie "Wag the Dog" where the president starts a war to call attention away from his infidelity.
So even now I have to ask myself why I am so concerned with my country and what it is supposed to be or striving to be. A lot of the seeds of my thought trace back to the early 60's when I was a child and started learning about racism supposedly only in the south - but then seeing it (not as overt or terroristic) in my very own neighborhood, on my very own street, which turned out to be the first to be 'integrated' in N.Buffalo.
I learned about the injustices and evils of racism from my parents. Not thru their explaining it to me (though they did) but by their actions and beliefs. My mother did not hesitate to take issue with any of our neighbors who did not want blacks on our street. Her attitude was that anyone who works hard and can afford to buy a house on our street or anywhere else, is entitled to do so. The whole thing about the unfairness of racism and the violence against blacks was probably one of the things that made me question or consider (I din't understand it in such clear terms or words in that time but the impression or whatevr u call it was definitely thtere.)
Anyway, then came the late, unthinking 60's where pretty much both sides of the war, anti war movement, where mostly dishonest. I was immediatley drawn into the peace love antiwar thing, and thought businesses where capitalist pigs and so on.
I think there fianlly came a time when through a combination of religious faith, and having to provide for a young family, that I for the most part no longer dealt with or considered world problems too much. I came to believe (and I'm sure there are many here that believe that) that man was inheritably corrupt, that he could never fix things, but God had a plan involving armageddon,etc. etc.
Everything was unresolvable, the world was an unjust place and my job was to simply do what I could for myself and family & leave all that stuff up to God.
Well my beliefe system has gradually and radically changed. I think that no matter what happens, good is a real thing and a force that can not be extinguished. Evil always destroys itself. Evil really is a house divided & I have to consider if Jesus ment something beyond the obvious when he said "how can satan stand against satan- he would destroy himself..."
After the 9/11 attacks against America, I really was affected. Because, though historically , we have done some horrendous things, like most other peoples and nations, we were ard are a country who does tremendously good things and are genuinely commited to being a good country. We do a lot of good & are far too often slandered by the people we help.
Their are financial and moral crisesis that seem to be growing ever so quikcly. But then, when I honestly consider America and the American people, and the American dream and vision, and the myraids of problems we are having, I get so frustrated. It seems to me, that so much of what is wrong , what is horrendous, all the injustice and hopeless- can end almost immediately. It is immediately in our grasp to fix things and bring about life, liberty & the persuit of happiess ---But the idea of opening our minds & doing the things that would really solve our problems is not considered. It seems to be impossible For a president or any politician to look us straight in the eye, and clearly commuicate how to fix up the US, and end laws that create evil. SUCH A BRAVE PERSON WOULD BE DESTROYED.
In conclusion, I think I consider this stuff a little too much for mixed reason. Maybe some of it is used by me to deflect from my own problems---but I guess there is something in me that believes that there is something I and others can and should do that we are not.
So when he said something directly in response to something I expressed, I was open to it knowing his motives were pure and he was able to understand what I ment. One of the issues I brought up was that I was very offended and bothered by the unjustice of drug laws even though by this point I was not using drugs illegaly and from some points of view (not NA) I was in recovery. He was a supporter of NA & at the same time realized that it was not necessarly the 'only way' for everyone - though he always encouraged me to go to meatings and take from them what I could. When it came to discussing my big concern with drug laws, and its affects on addicts, and the possibility that the laws themselves might be instrumental in getting people addicted or prolonging their addiction when they were trying to stop, HE SUGGESTED THAT HE THOUGHT I WAS GETTING CAUGHT UP IN WHAT NA CALLS 'STINKIN THINKIN.'
I seriously considered what he said and I do believe there was some truth in that. He was at least partially correct. At that point in my life, as right or wrong as I might be about the whole issue, and my frustration with it, was not all that relevant to anything. So part of it was very possible an attempt at self sabotage under the guise of something else, and part of it was a way for me to take my attention off myself & things I needed to work on. Kind of like movie "Wag the Dog" where the president starts a war to call attention away from his infidelity.
So even now I have to ask myself why I am so concerned with my country and what it is supposed to be or striving to be. A lot of the seeds of my thought trace back to the early 60's when I was a child and started learning about racism supposedly only in the south - but then seeing it (not as overt or terroristic) in my very own neighborhood, on my very own street, which turned out to be the first to be 'integrated' in N.Buffalo.
I learned about the injustices and evils of racism from my parents. Not thru their explaining it to me (though they did) but by their actions and beliefs. My mother did not hesitate to take issue with any of our neighbors who did not want blacks on our street. Her attitude was that anyone who works hard and can afford to buy a house on our street or anywhere else, is entitled to do so. The whole thing about the unfairness of racism and the violence against blacks was probably one of the things that made me question or consider (I din't understand it in such clear terms or words in that time but the impression or whatevr u call it was definitely thtere.)
Anyway, then came the late, unthinking 60's where pretty much both sides of the war, anti war movement, where mostly dishonest. I was immediatley drawn into the peace love antiwar thing, and thought businesses where capitalist pigs and so on.
I think there fianlly came a time when through a combination of religious faith, and having to provide for a young family, that I for the most part no longer dealt with or considered world problems too much. I came to believe (and I'm sure there are many here that believe that) that man was inheritably corrupt, that he could never fix things, but God had a plan involving armageddon,etc. etc.
Everything was unresolvable, the world was an unjust place and my job was to simply do what I could for myself and family & leave all that stuff up to God.
Well my beliefe system has gradually and radically changed. I think that no matter what happens, good is a real thing and a force that can not be extinguished. Evil always destroys itself. Evil really is a house divided & I have to consider if Jesus ment something beyond the obvious when he said "how can satan stand against satan- he would destroy himself..."
After the 9/11 attacks against America, I really was affected. Because, though historically , we have done some horrendous things, like most other peoples and nations, we were ard are a country who does tremendously good things and are genuinely commited to being a good country. We do a lot of good & are far too often slandered by the people we help.
Their are financial and moral crisesis that seem to be growing ever so quikcly. But then, when I honestly consider America and the American people, and the American dream and vision, and the myraids of problems we are having, I get so frustrated. It seems to me, that so much of what is wrong , what is horrendous, all the injustice and hopeless- can end almost immediately. It is immediately in our grasp to fix things and bring about life, liberty & the persuit of happiess ---But the idea of opening our minds & doing the things that would really solve our problems is not considered. It seems to be impossible For a president or any politician to look us straight in the eye, and clearly commuicate how to fix up the US, and end laws that create evil. SUCH A BRAVE PERSON WOULD BE DESTROYED.
In conclusion, I think I consider this stuff a little too much for mixed reason. Maybe some of it is used by me to deflect from my own problems---but I guess there is something in me that believes that there is something I and others can and should do that we are not.
