just out of curiosity..is there a certain rule to tapering? how is it done? and do you have to have a certain amount of pills to do it? thank you all kindly
I think it is different for everyone. Tell us a bit more about your story and will be able to help you better.
kass,
I just went back and read you previous posts to find out more details - what you take, how much. etc
Are you still on the patches?? I used to take those a long while back and they were not the easiest to stop - not quite as bad as methadone but definitely worse than just the lorcet pills.
You said in a previous post that you do not want to take Sub - WHY??
IMO it would make the w/d's much easier IF the Sub is used properly - - be careful and educate yourself on how to use it cause it is fairly new and majority of Sub Dr's are clueless about it - Dr is only required to take an 8-hour on-line course to get certified to Rx Sub which is a joke We are their guini pigs so they can learn about it while some people suffer cause of the lack of knowledge of the Dr - educate YOURSELF and you will be much better off !!
(And PLEASE DO NOT take methadone!!!! Sub is much better choice!!!)
The most important things to know about Sub are that you need to take the lowest dose possible - 8 mgs to start then taper down asap, for the shortest amount of time and taper down vey low - to 1/2 mg per day or every other day, then stop. If you do all of those things, the w/d's will be SOOOO much easier and definiely MUCH easier than stopping the patch & Lorcet alone.
Of course this is just my opinion.....but it is an experienced and educated opinion....
Also - get into some kind of face to face recovery program, such as NA, right away. The support can be the difference between success and failure
You CAN do this!!
<<<HUGS>>>
Swizzle
I just went back and read you previous posts to find out more details - what you take, how much. etc
Are you still on the patches?? I used to take those a long while back and they were not the easiest to stop - not quite as bad as methadone but definitely worse than just the lorcet pills.
You said in a previous post that you do not want to take Sub - WHY??
IMO it would make the w/d's much easier IF the Sub is used properly - - be careful and educate yourself on how to use it cause it is fairly new and majority of Sub Dr's are clueless about it - Dr is only required to take an 8-hour on-line course to get certified to Rx Sub which is a joke We are their guini pigs so they can learn about it while some people suffer cause of the lack of knowledge of the Dr - educate YOURSELF and you will be much better off !!
(And PLEASE DO NOT take methadone!!!! Sub is much better choice!!!)
The most important things to know about Sub are that you need to take the lowest dose possible - 8 mgs to start then taper down asap, for the shortest amount of time and taper down vey low - to 1/2 mg per day or every other day, then stop. If you do all of those things, the w/d's will be SOOOO much easier and definiely MUCH easier than stopping the patch & Lorcet alone.
Of course this is just my opinion.....but it is an experienced and educated opinion....
Also - get into some kind of face to face recovery program, such as NA, right away. The support can be the difference between success and failure
You CAN do this!!
<<<HUGS>>>
Swizzle
Sorry - I did not even answer your question above!! LOL
If you choose to taper:
First - someone else needs to be in control of your meds and give you each dose or each day's allotment - and you need to agree on the schedule, stick to it, and do not try to talk them into giving you any "extras"
(Most find it very difficult or even impossible to taper!! No shame in that....just part of addiction...though some are able to taper successfully...)
Second - you must take smaller doses spaced evenly thru the day - DO NOT take any large doses to try to "feel" the pills. Only one pill at a time allowed!! Don't try to chase a high!!
For a schedule:
Based on current use, decrease daily intake by 20% - 25% to start
Example:
Current use is 10 pills per day
Start taper day 1 at 8 pills per day - taken as ONE pill every 3 hours
Next day add one hour between dosages, keep adding another hour between doses each day until you are at one every 24 hours, then stop or go to 1/2 pill first and then stop.
Another option is to add a day or two in between each dosage cut - dependiing on how quickly you want to be tapered down to zero - but write out the taper schdule on paper and decide this before you start.
Hope that helps.....
If you choose to taper:
First - someone else needs to be in control of your meds and give you each dose or each day's allotment - and you need to agree on the schedule, stick to it, and do not try to talk them into giving you any "extras"
(Most find it very difficult or even impossible to taper!! No shame in that....just part of addiction...though some are able to taper successfully...)
Second - you must take smaller doses spaced evenly thru the day - DO NOT take any large doses to try to "feel" the pills. Only one pill at a time allowed!! Don't try to chase a high!!
For a schedule:
Based on current use, decrease daily intake by 20% - 25% to start
Example:
Current use is 10 pills per day
Start taper day 1 at 8 pills per day - taken as ONE pill every 3 hours
Next day add one hour between dosages, keep adding another hour between doses each day until you are at one every 24 hours, then stop or go to 1/2 pill first and then stop.
Another option is to add a day or two in between each dosage cut - dependiing on how quickly you want to be tapered down to zero - but write out the taper schdule on paper and decide this before you start.
Hope that helps.....
The way I set out taper schedules is like this:
1. stabilise your daily dose, stay on the exact same amount eor day for 1 week.
2. make sure your daily amount is split into at least 2 doses, morning and night.
3. drop 10% of your daily opiate dose. For example if you take 100mg of opiate a day, drop it 90mg per day by lowering your morning dose. Stay there for 5 days
4. Drop by another 10%, cutting the night time dose this time. Stay there for as long as it takes to feel OK but no more than 7 days.
Continue to cut 10% each time, alternatign between the mornign and night tiem doses. As you get lower, you will need to wait longer between each drop.
My experience is that if you do big drops, you will get withdrawals and relapse. If you go too slow, you will lose patience and bust.
The idea is to move as quickly as you can without having withdrawals that are too bad.
If you want to do a fast taper, you may as well just stop cold turkey.
1. stabilise your daily dose, stay on the exact same amount eor day for 1 week.
2. make sure your daily amount is split into at least 2 doses, morning and night.
3. drop 10% of your daily opiate dose. For example if you take 100mg of opiate a day, drop it 90mg per day by lowering your morning dose. Stay there for 5 days
4. Drop by another 10%, cutting the night time dose this time. Stay there for as long as it takes to feel OK but no more than 7 days.
Continue to cut 10% each time, alternatign between the mornign and night tiem doses. As you get lower, you will need to wait longer between each drop.
My experience is that if you do big drops, you will get withdrawals and relapse. If you go too slow, you will lose patience and bust.
The idea is to move as quickly as you can without having withdrawals that are too bad.
If you want to do a fast taper, you may as well just stop cold turkey.
Silent Partner -
While I may agree with 10% dose reductions to do a slow taper, I don't understand why you would say to take your current daily amount divided by 2 and dose only in the am and pm. EX: If someone is at 200 mgs per day of hydro, then they would take 100 mg in the am and 100 mg in the pm?? To me, that would not be a good idea at all cause that large of a dose would give you that high feeling twice a day and then feeling like crap the rest of the time. Wouldn't it be better to take the daily dose and divide it out thru the day into small doses so that the user does not FEEL high, yet has a consistent amount of hydro in their body to prevent w/d's - - then cut from there by increasing the TIME between the smaller doses??
Please let me know your thoughts....
Thx
Swizzle
While I may agree with 10% dose reductions to do a slow taper, I don't understand why you would say to take your current daily amount divided by 2 and dose only in the am and pm. EX: If someone is at 200 mgs per day of hydro, then they would take 100 mg in the am and 100 mg in the pm?? To me, that would not be a good idea at all cause that large of a dose would give you that high feeling twice a day and then feeling like crap the rest of the time. Wouldn't it be better to take the daily dose and divide it out thru the day into small doses so that the user does not FEEL high, yet has a consistent amount of hydro in their body to prevent w/d's - - then cut from there by increasing the TIME between the smaller doses??
Please let me know your thoughts....
Thx
Swizzle
Hey Swizzle, I think you have misunderstood me.
I am talking about someone who is taking one daily dose of 200 mg. Most of the addicts I deal with take all of their opiates at once, anything up 2800 mg.
I am talking about cutting their total daily intake in half (at least) if they are already spreading their intake over lots of small doses then they don't need to do that (eg they may be already taking 4 x 50 mg. Anyone taking a one off dose of 200 mg is not going to get high by taking 2 half doses because they have a tolerance.
We are actually saying the exact same thing. The only difference is that I stick with the same times and reduce the dose, rather than staying with the same dose and spreading out the time intervals.
I prefer to cut the dose becuse it means the person has a strict regime they follow, rather than having all the times changing over time.
Here is an example
I think also that psychogically taking less pills works better than taking the same amounts oover lonnger periods but that is just my opinion.
regards, Sean
I am talking about someone who is taking one daily dose of 200 mg. Most of the addicts I deal with take all of their opiates at once, anything up 2800 mg.
I am talking about cutting their total daily intake in half (at least) if they are already spreading their intake over lots of small doses then they don't need to do that (eg they may be already taking 4 x 50 mg. Anyone taking a one off dose of 200 mg is not going to get high by taking 2 half doses because they have a tolerance.
We are actually saying the exact same thing. The only difference is that I stick with the same times and reduce the dose, rather than staying with the same dose and spreading out the time intervals.
I prefer to cut the dose becuse it means the person has a strict regime they follow, rather than having all the times changing over time.
Here is an example
I think also that psychogically taking less pills works better than taking the same amounts oover lonnger periods but that is just my opinion.
regards, Sean
