Update On My Son/advice On Sub

Pain Pills
1
As some of you know,my middle son has been on Sub for quite some time now(not sure how long,maybe 4 months?)Hes addicted to pain pills and after many tries to quit/and relapsing,he finally went to rehab,got on sub and has been clean of the pain pills since.About a month ago(aftre staying here at home for 3 months recovering,bumming around,hanging witht he same croud)he moved from our state of NY to Florida with a friend(one of the few clean,hardworking,decent friends he had) and is doing so well.Hes got a great job making good money,days weekends off,out in the sun,life couldnt be better.Im just so very happy for him.

He started out taking 8 mg of sub each day(i think,i really dont remember,it could have been 16 mg)but at this point hes at 2 mg.He tried once to get off and lost it,went back on.Right now he has no Dr in Forida,his dr is here in NY.Actually his Dr. released him,gave him his last script before he left and moved(the dr would have continued the sub for awhile more but my son was moving so...)Anyway,he has about 8~8mg pills left and just called me,hes been afraid,afraid to get off them.Afraid it'll make him mess up his job,go back to his old way of life,etc...hes been lookign for a dr down there and finally found one that'll take him April 18th(hes relieved and has enough pills to last til then)

Im so torn,i want him off the sub so bad,yet from some of the tpeople here(and knowing a few people on the sub personally)they say sometimes a little longer on the sub is a good thing.I try and be supportive of him but i cant help but be cautious.I keep repeating the same things to him over and over again #1 you cant stay on these pills forever! #2 keep tapering,by next week,go from the 2 mg to just 1...etc...he said he tried to go without any at all today but by noon he was so exhausted at work and was running out of steam,back ache headache,he ended up taking his 2 mg dose.

Sorry this is so long,i just dont know what to think.Part of me wants him off.Part of me is happy he found a dr who will help,by the way,he called several drs and they all said the same thing,a wait a mile long,a year wait.The one he finally DID get had a originally said it would be a ONG wait,then once they found out he has already been on it and already had a dr who was monitoring him,they said they would take him the 18th of April.I just dont know aht to think.

Those of you on the sub,whats your opinion on this? I just wnat him to be happy and lead a productive life,but i dont want him to keep relying on a pill for that.

I also wanted to post a pic of him,hes such a handsome young man.Has so much goign for him,handsome,smart,great personality,just very fun loving.It breaks my heart what his life had become.Thanks for any advice.~KIM

user posted image
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Ok here is the answer. Because he has been on Sun for 4 months or more he should not be coming off quickly. He should be cutting his dose back quickly, 1mg per week at the very most and getting down to 0.5mg before he jumps off.

Can't he find another Dr to prescribe him Sub and give him a tapering regime??

Incidentally, 4 months is not a long time to be on Sub.

If he absolutely can't get anymore Sub, he should see a Dr to write him up for Clonidine and other drugs that will help with the withdrawals he is going to have.

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Why you in such a rush to get him off the sub? give him some time to get his stuff together and when hes comfortable and stronger mentally and physically he'll be able to get off easier.
Like SP says 4 months isnt a lot of time.

JD
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Thanks for your replies.Silent Partner~he has found a Dr,he will see him April 18th,and i hope and pray he will help him with a taper(im sure he will....eventually)

John Dee~My main concern is,he is becoming emotionallly so dependant on the sub as well as physically,i worry that when the time comes for him to get off,his life will fall apart,just when hes starting to really get it together.I just worry.

His Dr here in NY had told me,that when his life had adjusted,started to become normal/much less stressfull,that would be the time to start tapering and then get off.Well,hes at that point.He HAS tapered down to 2 mg,but now is going to go to another DR.I Just hope this Dr will be able to get him down to the 1 mg,and then off within a failry short period and the WD from that are tolreable.Its such a new drug and so much of it is unknown.I know it has literally saved his life!Again thanks~KIM
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It sounds like his fear is getting in the way of him moving on. Fear of withdrawals, which from what I've heard about sub at that does, isn't that bad. He's probably remembering the w/d;s from painpills. If he went to 1mg and jumped off when his 8 pills are gone, he would be fine. Is he in NA? Even with the sub he needs have that support, even more so when he gets off of it.

Kim...as parents it's just our way to want the best for our kids and to protect them, but at some point you have to let go (easier said than done). Give him your advice and then let him decide. Don't let it make you crazy which is what I hear in your voice. I also hear how proud you are of him and rightfully so...if he bumps his nose again, it's on him, not you. You can't prevent it or control what he does. I'm finding that out with my boy.

By the way, he is very good looking...

xxx
Lisa
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Thanks CG,i know all that you say is true.But nothing will ever stop my worrying.I dont preach to him,but i did voice my concerns,and he listens and eithre really gets a it and agrees or he just says what i want to hear so i wont worry.But i honestly feel hes on the right road right now and is going to make out alright,all by himself.Which is basically what ive wanted all along.But in my mind the worry worry worry will never go away,til the day i die,im sure.Thanks again for your very educated advice,i appreciate it.~KIM

PS~he is a handsome younge man,just like his brothers.He had such potential,that what killed his dad and i,very good athlete,smart,could have gone far.But...hes doing good now and hes happy,i cant ask for more.
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I wouldnt let him jump at 1 mg, he should lower to at least 1/2mg or 1/4 mg, also hes been on sub for 4 months, hes already dependant on it physically so the withdrawals wont be any different now than at 6-8 months, in fact an argument can be made that it will be easier at 6-8 months than right now.

JD
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I also think you should give it some more time. I can understand you being anxious but I think your son needs some time to get everything back as it should be. It sounds like he is doing great, and his life is no longer in danger from opiate abuse.

I am now on 6mg of sub per day. I started at 8mg, I have been on the sub since November. It has really saved my life. I am slowly...........very slowly going to taper off, but I am not out taking handfulls of oxy's everyday and that is an amazing thing for me.

Give it a little time..............Just my opinion.

You sound like a great mom, who is full of love and concern for her son.

By the way..................Wow!, he is a cutie!
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Your son is just gonna have to suck it up one day and tell himself he cant be a junky the rest of his life, just like the rest of us as we get clean, unfortunately your son like all pill addicts including myself are gonna have to go thru some withdrawls and a little pain for what we have done to ourselves, i'm on the sub myself and saw my dr today and he point blank told me there is no free lunch, and when your sub treatment is done your gonna have a little pain, and if you can't deal with it then your gonna have to be a junky for the rest of your life, he said the sub is only a small tool, and if you don't want to stop you will find every reason not to stop, and he's right, i wish there was an easy way out, but theirs not, so he's other gonna have to put his foot down, or end up a junky, just like i will. Goodluck
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He wont be fine if he does an 8 tablet taper, he will go into withdrawals, they will be unpleasant and it will increase his chance of relapsing.

Yes, he needs to look at other aspects of recovery to stay clean in the long term but his best bet is (a) to make this decision himself in conjunction with this Dr, (b) do a slow and monitored taper when he does come off, not rush off.

Yes, there will be some withdrawals at the end of his treatment but they will be nothing compared with what he will have if he does a fast taper after 4 months of treatment.

Please remember that jumping off early does NOT increase his chances of staying clean in the long run.
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Kim,

Your son is a good looking young boy with a long, good life ahead of him. I am so happy his life is coming together.

I agree with SP and JD (as usual.) Please don't rush the sub, and he shouldn't either. Studies show that long term sub users have the lowest rate of relapse, compared to short term sub users. I go through periods where I want off sub right now. But I am learning to listen and do this slowly.

WD will not be worse after 8 months on sub v/s 4 months on sub. He is at a very low dose, but he needs to taper off of it gradually. JD always says slow and steady wins the race, and he is right.

I have been treated by 2 different sub doctors, talked to a very knowledgeable pharmacist who is just graduating. She knows a lot about sub because it was approved shortly after she started pharmacy school. They all say the same thing. You can do a very fast detox on sub, but if you choose to stay on it longer, you have to take things slowly.

It would be a mistake to jump off at 1mg. He should go down to .5 or even less. My doctor also advises people to start taking it every other day toward the end.

I know you want him to be free of this. I want to be free of this. But, I am taking my time, and improving my odds of keeping off of narcotics for good. I know you want the best for him, and it really sounds like he is doing things the right way. I hope he does have some other support also.

I wish him the best...and you too.

Love,

Atlas
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Thanks everyone.Reading your replies makes me feel so much better.It just makes perfect sense,he wont be anymore dependent in 8 months as opposed to 4 months,right?

Hes a very smart boy,he knows what he has to do,and hes doing it,improving his life and couldnt be happier(except for still having to depend on a pill to function everyday)but he is taking it slow,thats why he decided to look for a Dr down there to stay on the sub for a few more months.I did give him some of the advice i got here last night,i told him do not try to come off 2 mg or even 1 mg,he needs to get it done to practically crumbs in order to make it successful.And he said"i know mom,thats what im trying to tell you"So,we're both on the same page,and hes making the right moves for himself.I am very proud of him.Im not going to worry anymore(yeah right!!!)

It was nice talking to him though(i do each wwek soemtimes twice)he was so upbeat,had just gotten out of work,went and bought himself a new pair of roller blades and was on his way to play roller hockey,what a change ,not only is he finally working full time,but finding time to keep busy and having fun right after work.The fact hes doing this on 2 mg at this point is encouraging.Again,thank you all so very much~KIM
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I need to stop pretending that I know what I'm talking about when it comes to Sub. Just when I think I've heard enough about it, to talk about it, I get corrected. I'm sorry guys.

CG
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Cowgirl Dont be Sorry. You really are full of great advice.

Heck, I have been on Sub since November, and I get corrected all the time. I would think I would know by now, but there is so much to learn.

Keep Doing what you do, Your great!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Kim I dont have any advice as you know my game plan but I wanted to say your son is very hansom.OH IF ONLY I WERE 15 YEARS YOUNGER>>>>LOL
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Kim you should be so proud of your son for having the maturity to deal with his addiction. I am glad you posted his picture - he reminded me a little bit of my son (whose picture is still up on the newbie picture thread - he would die to know it's there - but at least that thread is pretty well buried now!

Anyway - back to your son - I don't know a lot about sub except what I have read, researched and learned on this board- I am seeing an addiction specialist on Monday and I am sure it is one of things we will discuss as an option.

But I do agree in principal - in the scheme of his entire life, he should take he time, to provide more protection against a relapse. I truly do not think months will matter or as long as it takes.

Love
Sue/Enester